INFO-VAX Tue, 20 Feb 2007 Volume 2007 : Issue 102 Contents: How do I rename an Advanced Server Domain? RE: Major windoze Vista account ports to OpenVMS! Re: Oracle - DST 2007 heads up Re: Oracle - DST 2007 heads up Re: Oracle - DST 2007 heads up Re: Oracle - DST 2007 heads up Re: question: TCPware + SMTP Re: question: TCPware + SMTP Re: SYS$TIMEZONE_RULE problems Re: TCPIP : Lost default route Re: TCPIP : Lost default route Re: TCPIP : Lost default route Re: They are slowly coming home to the worlds ONLY virus free OS! Re: They are slowly coming home to the worlds ONLY virus free OS! Re: They are slowly coming home to the worlds ONLY virus free OS! Re: They are slowly coming home to the worlds ONLY virus free OS! Re: They are slowly coming home to the worlds ONLY virus free OS! Re: TSZ07 Re: TSZ07 Re: TSZ07 Re: TSZ07 Re: TSZ07 Re: TSZ07 Re: TSZ07 Re: VT320 or 420 keypad codes Re: VT320 or 420 keypad codes ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 20 Feb 2007 08:27:53 -0800 From: "syslost" Subject: How do I rename an Advanced Server Domain? Message-ID: <1171988873.599073.113420@j27g2000cwj.googlegroups.com> Production cluster: 2 ds25 alphas, running axp openvms 7.3-1, advanced server 7.3-140a Development cluster: 2 ds25 alphas, running axp openvms 7.3-1, advanced server 7.3-140a I took the full set of backups from the production cluster, and restored it to the development cluster. Before bringing the development cluster on to the network I changed the node names, systemids, ip addresses, decnet addresses, and references to production cluster found in miscellaneous dcl procedures... All was well until I got to advanced server. I used sys$startup:pwrk$config to change the domain name. Started advanced server, no users, no shares, no rights, just a new blank domain. After shutting down advanced server, I tried copying the saved production domain files from PWRK$LMROOT:[LANMAN.DATAFILES. 9FEB200712495546]ACL.;, BUILTIN.;, CHGLOG.LMX, LSA.;, and SHAREDB.; back to PWRK$LMROOT:[LANMAN.DATAFILES]. Then started advanced server. It started ok, but I couldn't issue any commands. I called HP to see if there was a way to rename a domain, or move my users, shares, and rights from an old domain to a new domain. There isn't, but they said there used to be a dcl procedure that would gather all the information from the old domain, and add it to the new domain. Does anyone know where I could get a copy of this procedure, or others ideas? cheers, Bill Reynolds ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2007 07:36:51 -0500 From: "Main, Kerry" Subject: RE: Major windoze Vista account ports to OpenVMS! Message-ID: > -----Original Message----- > From: Dave Froble [mailto:davef@tsoft-inc.com]=20 > Sent: February 19, 2007 3:30 PM > To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com > Subject: Re: Major windoze Vista account ports to OpenVMS! >=20 > david20@alpha2.mdx.ac.uk wrote: > > In article=20 > <8660a3a10702190544r10df700bnc568ee021f5ef2ec@mail.gmail.com>, > "William Webb" writes: > >> On 19 Feb 2007 04:53:52 -0800, bob@instantwhip.com=20 > wrote: > >>> http://www.openvms.org/stories.php?story=3D07/02/16/3329759 > >>> > >>> > >> Um, Earth to Bob? > >> > >> The only mention of Vista in the article refers to the name of the > >> vendor of the software product. > >> > > Yes it is a SCADA (supervisory control and data aquisition) system.=20 > > However to be fair to Bob the article does say that the VMS=20 > system replaced a > > windows based SCADA system due to the customer having=20 > suffered a virus which > > shut down the windows system for two days. > >=20 > >=20 > > David Webb > > Security team leader > > CCSS > > Middlesex University > >=20 > >=20 > >> WWWebb >=20 > What's really nice is that somebody in management decided=20 > that yes, he=20 > really could get fired for choosing windows, and regardless of the=20 > resistance of the windows advocates, made a decision in favor of less=20 > downtime and keeping his job. :-) >=20 > I wonder what the downtime cost was? Wonder how expensive it=20 > has to be=20 > before the windows advocates get overruled? >=20 > Lucky for VMS that someone with the vendor actually knew=20 > about VMS and=20 > wasn't afraid to rock the windows boat. >=20 While Linux and Windows have a place and do offer capabilities in certain areas, this is a good example of a company with an important application that realized they can not afford Windows. Imho, Linux falls into this same category.=20 However, and imho, bottom line is that both platforms have 5-20 *security* patches per month and these Cust's important applications need to be tested and QA'ed before releasing these patches to production.=20 So, their options are: 1. QA/testing times (big $'s in staff labour) go through the roof - at a time when business is looking more functionality from its app's and hence must often delay these new App features. 2. Ignore the risks and release the patches and hope for the best; 3. Ignore the security patches and risk exposing their application and data. Remember that 50-60% of most security issues are caused by internal issues, so one can not simply depend on external firewalls. Some choice. Regards Kerry Main Senior Consultant HP Services Canada Voice: 613-592-4660 Fax: 613-591-4477 kerryDOTmainAThpDOTcom (remove the DOT's and AT)=20 OpenVMS - the secure, multi-site OS that just works. ------------------------------ Date: 20 Feb 2007 07:18:38 -0600 From: koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) Subject: Re: Oracle - DST 2007 heads up Message-ID: <5NmBSV$VAMbg@eisner.encompasserve.org> In article <53tqacF1ssb8iU2@mid.individual.net>, bill@cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon) writes: > > Work isn't your whole day. When do you get up in the morning and when do > you go to sleep? I am willing to bet that both are in darkness like mine > are. I get up when it's still just barely dark. But I think the folks in northeastern Maine may not. > > Most DOT's recommend driving with your lights on all the time. No energy > saving there. A silly recommendation, like the third brakelight. Only works when it's unusual. Two of my cars drive around all day with thier headlights off, the third with low power "driving lights". > > The only change is going to be who pays. Do I use more lights at home > or at the office? The window is the same, the only thing that changes > is what I am doing at some particular tick of the clock. For you yes, for others, probably a monority, there is a savings because the day starts later or they are further east in thier time zones. If most people don't save energy and a minority do, then there is a net savings. ------------------------------ Date: 20 Feb 2007 07:25:48 -0600 From: koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) Subject: Re: Oracle - DST 2007 heads up Message-ID: In article <8162c$45d9b56c$cef8887a$32763@TEKSAVVY.COM>, JF Mezei writes: > Bob Koehler wrote: >> A little energy will be saved and Congress will be able to say they >> took action on our energy issues. > > It woudl have been much smarter for the USA to switch to the same time > change dates as the rest of the world. Smart? IIRC the Repubicans controlled Congress when this law was passed. As noted on many bumpers: "Vote Republican, it's easier than thinking". > Having to go through the troubles of changing the DST logic is stupid since > it is still going to be a proprietary USA time that some nearby courntries > are essentially forced to also adopt. Proprietary? The US owns time zones? I think US law controls time zones in the US, but I don't think they are objects that can be owned. > Countries near the USA who are forced, for practical reasons, to follow USA > changes have no say/vote in your political process. It is very unfortunate > that locally elected proliticians are allowed to impose their will outside > their own jurisdiction. If Arizona doesn't follow the US standard, why in the world should Canada or Mexico? In this case local politicians have trumped the feds. > Time changes should involve cooperative effort between countries, not some > unilateral decision by local politicians of one country who just want to be > able to brag about having solved the ebergy problem without really thinking > thorugh all the ramifications. So vote for politicians who think like you because the ones we have now disagree. > They can do all they want that affects only their jurisdisdiction. but when > it has effects outside their jurisdiction, it shouldn't be so easy for > uneducated stupid baby kissing politicians to pass some silly law. It's always easy for uneducated politicians to pass silly laws. But if you think I'm going to let one kiss my baby, you don't know me very well. ------------------------------ Date: 20 Feb 2007 14:09:27 GMT From: bill@cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon) Subject: Re: Oracle - DST 2007 heads up Message-ID: <540donF1utujsU1@mid.individual.net> In article <5NmBSV$VAMbg@eisner.encompasserve.org>, koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) writes: > In article <53tqacF1ssb8iU2@mid.individual.net>, bill@cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon) writes: >> >> Work isn't your whole day. When do you get up in the morning and when do >> you go to sleep? I am willing to bet that both are in darkness like mine >> are. > > I get up when it's still just barely dark. But I think the folks in > northeastern Maine may not. I am hardly in Maine. :-) But it is stone dark when I get up and stone dark when I go to bed. > >> >> Most DOT's recommend driving with your lights on all the time. No energy >> saving there. > > A silly recommendation, like the third brakelight. Only works when > it's unusual. Two of my cars drive around all day with thier > headlights off, the third with low power "driving lights". Most government "recommendations" are silly. But they still have this strange tendency to become mandatory. (Let's not even get into what they did to cars like the MG when congress decided they were automotive engineers!!) > >> >> The only change is going to be who pays. Do I use more lights at home >> or at the office? The window is the same, the only thing that changes >> is what I am doing at some particular tick of the clock. > > For you yes, for others, probably a monority, there is a savings > because the day starts later or they are further east in thier time > zones. And if it get's light earlier int he morning it gets dark correspondingly earlier in the evening. The amount of daylight doesn't change, only where it falls in your active window. Now, if your rich and don't have to work for a living you can stay in bed until 9:00 AM and not have to worry about the morning dark. Or just vacation in Australia for the winter. Sadly the majority can't do that. And their day is definitely longer than the 8-9 hours of dayight. > > If most people don't save energy and a minority do, then there is a > net savings. But no one "saves" anything. You merely relocate it. My day, like the majority of working stiffs, starts about 6:00 AM (5:00 AM some days) and runs til 10:00 or 11:00 PM. Dark at both ends. If you move the beginning so that it coincides with first light, it merely makes it dark earlier on the other end. The only way there is any savings is if your active day is shorter than the daylight time. Right now, that is just under 11 hours. How I wish my day was less than 11 hours long. Heck, I just spent the month of January with a work day of 13 hours a day. And that doesn't even take into consideratio the things one has to do outside of work!! I still fail to see where shifting the clock "saves" anything at all. In most cases, the effect on the human body of messing with the clock probably cancels that due to changes in our behaviour patterns. Just one more thing the government should keep its nose out of!! bill -- Bill Gunshannon | de-moc-ra-cy (di mok' ra see) n. Three wolves bill@cs.scranton.edu | and a sheep voting on what's for dinner. University of Scranton | Scranton, Pennsylvania | #include ------------------------------ Date: 20 Feb 2007 14:11:32 GMT From: bill@cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon) Subject: Re: Oracle - DST 2007 heads up Message-ID: <540dskF1utujsU2@mid.individual.net> In article , koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) writes: > In article <8162c$45d9b56c$cef8887a$32763@TEKSAVVY.COM>, JF Mezei writes: >> >> They can do all they want that affects only their jurisdisdiction. but when >> it has effects outside their jurisdiction, it shouldn't be so easy for >> uneducated stupid baby kissing politicians to pass some silly law. > > It's always easy for uneducated politicians to pass silly laws. But > if you think I'm going to let one kiss my baby, you don't know me > very well. I think you both got it wrong. It's kissing hands and shaking babies. :-) bill -- Bill Gunshannon | de-moc-ra-cy (di mok' ra see) n. Three wolves bill@cs.scranton.edu | and a sheep voting on what's for dinner. University of Scranton | Scranton, Pennsylvania | #include ------------------------------ Date: 20 Feb 2007 07:39:40 -0600 From: koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) Subject: Re: question: TCPware + SMTP Message-ID: <07YPOTsOZ7Uv@eisner.encompasserve.org> In article <1171902209.479978.242400@h3g2000cwc.googlegroups.com>, "n.rieck@sympatico.ca" writes: > $ if f$trn("TCPWARE_SMTP_QUEUE","LNM$SYSTEM_TABLE").nes."" then - > undef/executive TCPWARE_SMTP_QUEUE > %SYSTEM-F-NOLOGNAM, no logical name match Who wrote restart.com? Abreviating f$trnlnm to f$trn and might fail with some future release of VMS, procs you rely on should not abreviate. I assume undef is some symbol for deassign. The problem is that f$trnlnm is looking in the system table and not necessarily at executive mode names but the undef/executive may not be looking at the system table and is looking only at executive mode names. Look and see what the symbol undef actually stands for. Then add ,,"EXECUTIVE" to the f$trnlnm. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2007 09:26:21 -0500 From: "Richard Whalen" Subject: Re: question: TCPware + SMTP Message-ID: I didn't look into the history of the command file, and I wasn't able to quickly determine why the particular logical might occasionally be defined in a mode other then executive, but I have made changes to insure that it looks for the logical in the correct mode in the future. Richard Whalen Process Software "Bob Koehler" wrote in message news:07YPOTsOZ7Uv@eisner.encompasserve.org... > In article <1171902209.479978.242400@h3g2000cwc.googlegroups.com>, "n.rieck@sympatico.ca" writes: > > > $ if f$trn("TCPWARE_SMTP_QUEUE","LNM$SYSTEM_TABLE").nes."" then - > > undef/executive TCPWARE_SMTP_QUEUE > > %SYSTEM-F-NOLOGNAM, no logical name match > > Who wrote restart.com? > > Abreviating f$trnlnm to f$trn and might fail with some future release > of VMS, procs you rely on should not abreviate. I assume undef is > some symbol for deassign. > > The problem is that f$trnlnm is looking in the system table and not > necessarily at executive mode names but the undef/executive may not > be looking at the system table and is looking only at executive mode > names. Look and see what the symbol undef actually stands for. > Then add ,,"EXECUTIVE" to the f$trnlnm. > ------------------------------ Date: 20 Feb 2007 07:29:16 GMT From: healyzh@aracnet.com Subject: Re: SYS$TIMEZONE_RULE problems Message-ID: Bill Hall wrote: > Verify that you have a command procedure > SYS$STARTUP:TDF$UTC_STARTUP.COM. If it doesn't exist, run > UTC$TIME_SETUP.COM to create a new one. If it does exist, check the > logic in the procedure. The logic may be "bad" if the procedure was > created a long time ago and you have done DECnet/DTSS/UCX > reconfigurations. If so, just delete TDF$UTC_STARTUP.COM and run > TC$TIME_SETUP.COM to create a new one that should work. It is definitely possible that a reconfig is the problem. I originally had the system running DECnet-Plus, and am now running DECnet Phase IV. After some more looking, it would appear that part of my problem is that UTC$TIME_SETUP.COM itself expects DTSS to be installed as it calls SYS$UPDATE:DTSS$INSTALL_TIMEZONE_RULE.COM (which does exist). Zane ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2007 02:58:45 -0600 From: Dan Foster Subject: Re: TCPIP : Lost default route Message-ID: In article , JF Mezei wrote: > Dan Foster wrote: >> A default route typically references a particular interface. > > In what way is a default route attached to an interface ? (in VMS terms, > which commands attach it to an interface ?). Internal, rather than an explicit binding specified by the admin per se. Much of the TCP/IP Services for OpenVMS product is derived from UNIX code, I believe? In UNIX, default route selection is used for determining where outbound TCP/IP packets exits the machine. To do that, the system admin sets a default route pointing to an IP. The kernel then searches the directly connected interfaces on a system to find best match for the IP (by subnet). Once it finds which interface corresponds to the given default route IP address, it remembers that. So from that point on, any best match outbound IP traffic may hit that interface. In essence, the default route is inherently tied/attached to the interface it corresponds to. So when that interface "disappears", so does the default route. Even if it is for only a moment. This has other benefits: it provides an opportunity for backup routes to provide a path out of the machine through an alternate interface/path if configured that way (in UNIX; not sure about VMS). Example: PPP interface -- link is lost, interface goes down. Default route through PPP gets removed automatically by the kernel. Backup default route through some other interface kicks in -- perhaps through Ethernet or cable modem or ISDN -- if previously configured by the system administrator. (This is how it can work on modern UNIX.) However, it also can be a PITA for the system admin whom must remember to manually readd the default route if he/she bounces the interface or does something that has similar effect. Sometimes this can only safely be done via the console. -Dan ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2007 04:07:05 -0800 From: "John Gemignani, Jr." Subject: Re: TCPIP : Lost default route Message-ID: "Dan Foster" wrote in message news:slrnetle25.vb1.usenet@zappy.catbert.org... > In article , JF Mezei > wrote: >> Dan Foster wrote: >>> A default route typically references a particular interface. >> >> In what way is a default route attached to an interface ? (in VMS terms, >> which commands attach it to an interface ?). > > Internal, rather than an explicit binding specified by the admin per se. > > Much of the TCP/IP Services for OpenVMS product is derived from UNIX > code, I believe? In UNIX, default route selection is used for > determining where outbound TCP/IP packets exits the machine. For those routes that are not otherwise described by a routing table entry. The route usually has an interface target that is itself a router, providing routing services for you since you don't have the capability. JF turned on gateway and forwarding. Under normal circumstances, it is expecting that the routing table will be maintained using ROUTED and GATED. > > To do that, the system admin sets a default route pointing to an IP. The > kernel then searches the directly connected interfaces on a system to > find best match for the IP (by subnet). > > Once it finds which interface corresponds to the given default route IP > address, it remembers that. So from that point on, any best match > outbound IP traffic may hit that interface. > > In essence, the default route is inherently tied/attached to the > interface it corresponds to. > > So when that interface "disappears", so does the default route. Even if > it is for only a moment. > > This has other benefits: it provides an opportunity for backup routes to > provide a path out of the machine through an alternate interface/path if > configured that way (in UNIX; not sure about VMS). > > Example: PPP interface -- link is lost, interface goes down. Default > route through PPP gets removed automatically by the kernel. Backup > default route through some other interface kicks in -- perhaps through > Ethernet or cable modem or ISDN -- if previously configured by the > system administrator. (This is how it can work on modern UNIX.) > > However, it also can be a PITA for the system admin whom must remember > to manually readd the default route if he/she bounces the interface or > does something that has similar effect. Sometimes this can only safely > be done via the console. > > -Dan ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2007 07:43:02 -0500 From: "Richard B. gilbert" Subject: Re: TCPIP : Lost default route Message-ID: <45DAECD6.6060600@comcast.net> Dan Foster wrote: > In article , JF Mezei wrote: > >>Dan Foster wrote: >> >>>A default route typically references a particular interface. >> >>In what way is a default route attached to an interface ? (in VMS terms, >>which commands attach it to an interface ?). > > > Internal, rather than an explicit binding specified by the admin per se. > > Much of the TCP/IP Services for OpenVMS product is derived from UNIX > code, I believe? Damn near all of it, I believe. Everybody ported the Berkeley code. DEC just did it several years after TGV, Wollongong and everybody else. ------------------------------ Date: 20 Feb 2007 07:42:55 -0600 From: koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) Subject: Re: They are slowly coming home to the worlds ONLY virus free OS! Message-ID: In article <53ur73F1ueg34U1@mid.individual.net>, bill@cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon) writes: > Yeah, I know. People are always telling me about "that VMS thing that > used to exist. But it's been dead now for quite a while." Lot's of > exposure. Heck, you can see it mentioned in any trade journal you > pick up. If oyu happen to pick one up in a doctor's office where the > magazies are always 10-15 years old. Lot's of exposure? That's more than OS9000. I just heard of it for the first time in this thread. You care to tell us what journal in your dentist's office covers OS9000? ------------------------------ Date: 20 Feb 2007 15:02:27 GMT From: bill@cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon) Subject: Re: They are slowly coming home to the worlds ONLY virus free OS! Message-ID: <540gs3F1unoc0U1@mid.individual.net> In article <1171975870.628491.170940@j27g2000cwj.googlegroups.com>, bob@instantwhip.com writes: > > but you always tote unix over vms which shows how much you know ... You really do have no reading comprehension, do you? I don't tout (tote means "to carry") unix over VMS I tout using the right tools for the job. There is no single answer to all problems. In this case, I was touting OS9000 which is a RTOS with 0 vulnerabilites in the CERT DB. Your criteria for security and reliability. That's less than VMS. > > people who care about getting no viruses, staying up for years and > getting the lowest tco possible listen to me ... I doubt it. Unless they are looking for a good laugh. > its obvious that you > are not one of them and your employer suffers the end result ... How does my employer suffer? My servers run 24 hours a day, 265 days a year. We have not had a virus on one of our PC's since Windows98 went away. We have never had a virus on a Unix machine. We have not had a succesful break-in since SunOS. I run 12 Unix servers, 5 Windows servers, 3 PC labs and several dozen pc's in faculty offices. I do this as a one man shop. Our datacenter uses VMS, has more VMS admins than they have VMS machines. And has more scheduled downtime than I have. Tell me again about TCO..... > costly convulution ... I think you smoke the same stuff as JF sometimes. Either that or you just live in an alternate reality. VMS has it's place and it's uses. I regret that my last VMS machines are sitting in the other room hoping for a new home before I have to send them to the landfill. I regret that the students will no longer get a chance to at least learn of VMS's existence. But, that is reality. And everyone here knows where the blame for that lies. You spouting off crap that just shows how little you know about the industry today doesn't help VMS's chances. bill -- Bill Gunshannon | de-moc-ra-cy (di mok' ra see) n. Three wolves bill@cs.scranton.edu | and a sheep voting on what's for dinner. University of Scranton | Scranton, Pennsylvania | #include ------------------------------ Date: 20 Feb 2007 15:17:08 GMT From: bill@cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon) Subject: Re: They are slowly coming home to the worlds ONLY virus free OS! Message-ID: <540hnjF1ui01pU1@mid.individual.net> In article , koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) writes: > In article <53ur73F1ueg34U1@mid.individual.net>, bill@cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon) writes: > >> Yeah, I know. People are always telling me about "that VMS thing that >> used to exist. But it's been dead now for quite a while." Lot's of >> exposure. Heck, you can see it mentioned in any trade journal you >> pick up. If oyu happen to pick one up in a doctor's office where the >> magazies are always 10-15 years old. > > Lot's of exposure? That's more than OS9000. I just heard of it for > the first time in this thread. You care to tell us what journal in > your dentist's office covers OS9000? Guess you don't do much Real-time. :-) OS9000 (now being marketed once again as OS9) was the portable re-write of what started as OS9 for the 6809, later OS9-68K. The re-write and rename was done in 1989. Runs on many architectures and works great for embeded applications as well os your run-of-the-mill Real-time. The company, Microware, that does it has been around since 1977. And has never been sold to or raped by a PC vendor. They have and have had for some time, the lion's share of the RTOS market. I have worked with OS9 in it's various flavours almost as long as I have been working with Unix. I still have it at home in order to keep my skills sharp. I was actually just looking yesterday at a SCSI upgrade for my old 6809. :-) bill -- Bill Gunshannon | de-moc-ra-cy (di mok' ra see) n. Three wolves bill@cs.scranton.edu | and a sheep voting on what's for dinner. University of Scranton | Scranton, Pennsylvania | #include ------------------------------ Date: 20 Feb 2007 15:23:13 GMT From: bill@cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon) Subject: Re: They are slowly coming home to the worlds ONLY virus free OS! Message-ID: <540i31F1ui01pU2@mid.individual.net> In article <45dafcc5$0$3581$815e3792@news.qwest.net>, "Michael D. Ober" writes: > > "Bob Koehler" wrote in message > news:SH1eAn0g7D8J@eisner.encompasserve.org... >> In article <53ur73F1ueg34U1@mid.individual.net>, bill@cs.uofs.edu (Bill >> Gunshannon) writes: >> >>> Yeah, I know. People are always telling me about "that VMS thing that >>> used to exist. But it's been dead now for quite a while." Lot's of >>> exposure. Heck, you can see it mentioned in any trade journal you >>> pick up. If oyu happen to pick one up in a doctor's office where the >>> magazies are always 10-15 years old. >> >> Lot's of exposure? That's more than OS9000. I just heard of it for >> the first time in this thread. You care to tell us what journal in >> your dentist's office covers OS9000? >> > > Bob, > > That's because you and most of this group, including myself anymore, don't > do real-time (RT), time critical computing. Although VMS can get close, it > is simply _NOT_ a real-time OS in the sense that when an event occurs, the > OS will guarantee it handles the event within a specified time. OS9000 is a > RT OS and does make these types of guarantees. However, the tradeoff for > these guarantees is that OS9000 isn't very good for general purpose > computing. Well, we were talking SCADA, weren't we? Would you use the same machine for your GP computing? :-) Of course, I am not so sure what you mean by "isn't very good for general purpose computing". In what way? If you saw the performance that it squeezed out of the 6809 in its youth, you might want to change that opinion. (Hint: I can run multi-user/multi-processing on a 2 mhz 8bit processor with two floppy disks.) While I would not recommend it for use as a GP computing platform (picking the right tool for the job being the first step of SE) there is really no reason why it can't do what most Unix platforms can do other than the same problem VMS has, lack of available appliactions. Of course, most of the Unix stuff would probably port to OS9 faster than to VMS. bill -- Bill Gunshannon | de-moc-ra-cy (di mok' ra see) n. Three wolves bill@cs.scranton.edu | and a sheep voting on what's for dinner. University of Scranton | Scranton, Pennsylvania | #include ------------------------------ Date: 20 Feb 2007 10:37:39 -0600 From: cornelius@encompasserve.org (George Cornelius) Subject: Re: They are slowly coming home to the worlds ONLY virus free OS! Message-ID: In article <540i31F1ui01pU2@mid.individual.net>, bill@cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon) writes: > Well, we were talking SCADA, weren't we? [...] "Vsystem has supported OpenVMS for over 18 years and other operating systems for over 15 years." [Vista related press release at OpenVMS.org] Perhaps you would like to call up the Vista folks and let them know how delusional they are. Real time has many definitions. If you'll look at an earlier post in this thread you'll note that there may be "real time controllers" in the picture. You can run your OS/9 there. I'm not going to argue with success. You, on the other hand, have invented an argument with the Vista people out of the clear blue sky. You want to drive Bob out of existence by demolishing his arguments, but sometimes he quotes someone who knows something. [Hmm. Los Alamos, New Mexico. Can't imagine who they might have in their customer base.] -- George Cornelius cornelius()eisner.decus.org cornelius()mayo.edu ------------------------------ Date: 20 Feb 2007 07:34:34 -0600 From: koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) Subject: Re: TSZ07 Message-ID: In article <53u1raF1trdg0U1@mid.individual.net>, bill@triangle.cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon) writes: > Anybody got experience with a TSZ07 tape drive? Everytime I try > to load a tape it just runs for a few seconds and then gets a > "Motor Fault". If I try to manually load the tape it rewinds it > back off the take-up reel and then the same error. Anybody have > any suggestions that might save me some time before I tear into > this thing? IMHO open the top cover and clean the thing by hand once (the same cover you opened to load the tape by hand). That generally cears up anything that's not a real hardware failure. We've run a couple of these for decades without trouble but I suspect you really do have a faulty motor. ------------------------------ Date: 20 Feb 2007 07:47:27 -0600 From: koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) Subject: Re: TSZ07 Message-ID: <0B2Jsue39l02@eisner.encompasserve.org> In article , rdeininger@mindspringdot.com (Robert Deininger) writes: > > To test the drive, I grabbed an old archive tape off the rack and spun it > up. The save set, written in 1985, restored completely with no errors. I > was kind of surprised; conventional wisdom says a tape that old shouldn't > be readable. I couldn't find any sign of oxide loss either. Must have > been a good batch of tape. Or could it have been BACKUP's CRC and GROUP making up for the tape errors? On TU45 you could tell when the drive slewed the tape back and forth while trying 8 times to read a bad block. But on my TSZ07 it's hard to see the tape while it's moving. ------------------------------ Date: 20 Feb 2007 16:02:19 GMT From: bill@cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon) Subject: Re: TSZ07 Message-ID: <540kcbF1ukp6qU1@mid.individual.net> In article <1171986778.998733.122040@h3g2000cwc.googlegroups.com>, "Rich Jordan" writes: > On Feb 19, 10:33 am, b...@triangle.cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon) > wrote: >> Anybody got experience with a TSZ07 tape drive? Everytime I try >> to load a tape it just runs for a few seconds and then gets a >> "Motor Fault". If I try to manually load the tape it rewinds it >> back off the take-up reel and then the same error. Anybody have >> any suggestions that might save me some time before I tear into >> this thing? >> > > Bill, > My experience is with the TSZ05; I'm not certain if the 07 is > compatible as far as housing, cabling, etc, but: open the mechanism > up; there should be a metal latch in the front panel underneath the > controls; the whole top of the drive mechanism will lift up. There's > a latch inside to hold it up. Inspect all the cables and > connections. Blow out the dust and dead critters. You may want to > reseat all the cables you can. > Actually, I got a copy of the Tech Manual. It list probable bad units but I suspect it may be dust in the sensor that detects movement of the take up reel. I blew out everything on the top but I suspect it is going to need some disassembly and a more thourough blowing out. It was stored in a garage before I got it and I don't know for how long. I have seen the inside of these motors and a little dust is all it would take to make it not work. The drive is in really good condition (based on visual inspection) so I really don't think it is broken. If course, because of the conditions it was stored in re- seating all the cables is on my list as well. I just thought someone with experience with on of these may have had more concrete ideas. Thanks all. bill -- Bill Gunshannon | de-moc-ra-cy (di mok' ra see) n. Three wolves bill@cs.scranton.edu | and a sheep voting on what's for dinner. University of Scranton | Scranton, Pennsylvania | #include ------------------------------ Date: 20 Feb 2007 07:52:59 -0800 From: "Rich Jordan" Subject: Re: TSZ07 Message-ID: <1171986778.998733.122040@h3g2000cwc.googlegroups.com> On Feb 19, 10:33 am, b...@triangle.cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon) wrote: > Anybody got experience with a TSZ07 tape drive? Everytime I try > to load a tape it just runs for a few seconds and then gets a > "Motor Fault". If I try to manually load the tape it rewinds it > back off the take-up reel and then the same error. Anybody have > any suggestions that might save me some time before I tear into > this thing? > > bill > > -- > Bill Gunshannon | de-moc-ra-cy (di mok' ra see) n. Three wolves > b...@cs.scranton.edu | and a sheep voting on what's for dinner. > University of Scranton | > Scranton, Pennsylvania | #include Bill, My experience is with the TSZ05; I'm not certain if the 07 is compatible as far as housing, cabling, etc, but: open the mechanism up; there should be a metal latch in the front panel underneath the controls; the whole top of the drive mechanism will lift up. There's a latch inside to hold it up. Inspect all the cables and connections. Blow out the dust and dead critters. You may want to reseat all the cables you can. Rich ------------------------------ Date: 20 Feb 2007 09:50:45 -0800 From: bob.birch@gmail.com Subject: Re: TSZ07 Message-ID: <1171993845.236668.188870@p10g2000cwp.googlegroups.com> On Feb 20, 8:02 am, b...@cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon) wrote: > In article <1171986778.998733.122...@h3g2000cwc.googlegroups.com>, > "Rich Jordan" writes: > > > > > On Feb 19, 10:33 am, b...@triangle.cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon) > > wrote: > >> Anybody got experience with a TSZ07 tape drive? Everytime I try > >> to load a tape it just runs for a few seconds and then gets a > >> "Motor Fault". If I try to manually load the tape it rewinds it > >> back off the take-up reel and then the same error. Anybody have > >> any suggestions that might save me some time before I tear into > >> this thing? > > > Bill, > > My experience is with the TSZ05; I'm not certain if the 07 is > > compatible as far as housing, cabling, etc, but: open the mechanism > > up; there should be a metal latch in the front panel underneath the > > controls; the whole top of the drive mechanism will lift up. There's > > a latch inside to hold it up. Inspect all the cables and > > connections. Blow out the dust and dead critters. You may want to > > reseat all the cables you can. > > Actually, I got a copy of the Tech Manual. It list probable bad units > but I suspect it may be dust in the sensor that detects movement of > the take up reel. I blew out everything on the top but I suspect it > is going to need some disassembly and a more thourough blowing out. > It was stored in a garage before I got it and I don't know for how > long. I have seen the inside of these motors and a little dust is > all it would take to make it not work. The drive is in really good > condition (based on visual inspection) so I really don't think it is > broken. If course, because of the conditions it was stored in re- > seating all the cables is on my list as well. I just thought someone > with experience with on of these may have had more concrete ideas. > > Thanks all. > > bill > > -- > Bill Gunshannon | de-moc-ra-cy (di mok' ra see) n. Three wolves > b...@cs.scranton.edu | and a sheep voting on what's for dinner. > University of Scranton | > Scranton, Pennsylvania | #include I've repaired the DEC TLZ07 in the field and in the shop. It's a DAT Drive made by ARCHIVE called a Python. I think Seagate bought Archive ? It was in a shoebox and a moderate hassle to get out, but once out of the box you cud get to most of the major assemblies. Dont know if your TSZ07 is the same but it mite be. Once it out of the box you can inspect or meter the motors or look for a tag on who made them. If it's bad motor thats pretty easy to determine. ------------------------------ Date: 20 Feb 2007 17:58:46 GMT From: bill@cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon) Subject: Re: TSZ07 Message-ID: <540r6mF1ut6cpU1@mid.individual.net> In article <1171993845.236668.188870@p10g2000cwp.googlegroups.com>, bob.birch@gmail.com writes: > > I've repaired the DEC TLZ07 in the field and > in the shop. It's a DAT Drive made by ARCHIVE > called a Python. I think Seagate bought Archive ? > It was in a shoebox and a moderate hassle to get > out, but once out of the box you cud get to most > of the major assemblies. > > Dont know if your TSZ07 is the same but it mite > be. Once it out of the box you can inspect or > meter the motors or look for a tag on who made > them. If it's bad motor thats pretty easy to determine. TSZ07 is a DEC SCSI 9-track. bill -- Bill Gunshannon | de-moc-ra-cy (di mok' ra see) n. Three wolves bill@cs.scranton.edu | and a sheep voting on what's for dinner. University of Scranton | Scranton, Pennsylvania | #include ------------------------------ Date: 20 Feb 2007 10:15:21 -0800 From: bob.birch@gmail.com Subject: Re: TSZ07 Message-ID: <1171995321.118262.268870@p10g2000cwp.googlegroups.com> On Feb 20, 9:58 am, b...@cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon) wrote: > In article <1171993845.236668.188...@p10g2000cwp.googlegroups.com>, > bob.bi...@gmail.com writes: > > > > > I've repaired the DEC TLZ07 in the field and > > in the shop. It's a DAT Drive made by ARCHIVE > > called a Python. I think Seagate bought Archive ? > > It was in a shoebox and a moderate hassle to get > > out, but once out of the box you cud get to most > > of the major assemblies. > > > Dont know if your TSZ07 is the same but it mite > > be. Once it out of the box you can inspect or > > meter the motors or look for a tag on who made > > them. If it's bad motor thats pretty easy to determine. > > TSZ07 is a DEC SCSI 9-track. > > bill > > -- > Bill Gunshannon | de-moc-ra-cy (di mok' ra see) n. Three wolves > b...@cs.scranton.edu | and a sheep voting on what's for dinner. > University of Scranton | > Scranton, Pennsylvania | #include Sorry wrong drive....just googled it and the pictures look like a Cipher M990. Easier drive to repair, bigger and easier access plus two reel motors, if it's a Cipher ? ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2007 13:07:08 -0000 From: Thomas Dickey Subject: Re: VT320 or 420 keypad codes Message-ID: <12tlsjsdl1inta8@corp.supernews.com> roland@logikalsolutions.com wrote: > Hello all, > I was poking around with the KONSOLE program which comes with SuSE > Linux 10.2 AMD64 edition and found it does a fairly descent job of > VT420 emulation, sans the keypad codes. I found the config file, and odd, but when I run vttest, it doesn't. It's a subset of vt100 with a few of the vt220 escape codes such as ECH. Although vt100 is a subset of vt220 is a subset of ... vt420, it's not reasonable to say that konsole emulates vt420. ftp://invisible-island.net/vttest/ (The keypad codes for example, are a vt100 feature) > the comment, and the Qt header file. Someone just didn't have the > scan codes to enter for translation. It looks like it is completely > doable with just a few minutes of work...anyone have a link to the > scan codes sent back by the keypad keys? I looked at VT100.NET and > didn't see what I needed. > The X-term stuff shipping with this version is pretty annoying. No > cutting and pasting with mouse and no screen printing. KONSOLE seems > to interpret the codes coming back to the screen correctly and > correctly handle the function keys. It just needs the mapping for the > keypad filled out. xterm supports ANSI color, VT220 emulation and UTF-8 There's an faq at http://invisible-island.net/xterm/xterm.faq.html ftp://invisible-island.net/xterm/ > Thanks, > Roland -- Thomas E. Dickey http://invisible-island.net ftp://invisible-island.net ------------------------------ Date: 20 Feb 2007 06:56:19 -0800 From: "Steve Bainbridge" Subject: Re: VT320 or 420 keypad codes Message-ID: <1171983379.066949.192590@a75g2000cwd.googlegroups.com> On Feb 20, 1:07 pm, Thomas Dickey wrote: > rol...@logikalsolutions.com wrote: > > Hello all, > > I was poking around with the KONSOLE program which comes with SuSE > > Linux 10.2 AMD64 edition and found it does a fairly descent job of > > VT420 emulation, sans the keypad codes. I found the config file, and > > odd, but when I run vttest, it doesn't. > > It's a subset of vt100 with a few of the vt220 escape codes such as ECH. > > Although vt100 is a subset of vt220 is a subset of ... vt420, > it's not reasonable to say that konsole emulates vt420. > > ftp://invisible-island.net/vttest/ > > (The keypad codes for example, are a vt100 feature) > > > the comment, and the Qt header file. Someone just didn't have the > > scan codes to enter for translation. It looks like it is completely > > doable with just a few minutes of work...anyone have a link to the > > scan codes sent back by the keypad keys? I looked at VT100.NET and > > didn't see what I needed. > > The X-term stuff shipping with this version is pretty annoying. No > > cutting and pasting with mouse and no screen printing. KONSOLE seems > > to interpret the codes coming back to the screen correctly and > > correctly handle the function keys. It just needs the mapping for the > > keypad filled out. > > xterm supports ANSI color, VT220 emulation and UTF-8 > There's an faq at > http://invisible-island.net/xterm/xterm.faq.html > ftp://invisible-island.net/xterm/ > > > Thanks, > > Roland > > -- > Thomas E. Dickeyhttp://invisible-island.netftp://invisible-island.net Hi, Is it possible to use xterm to access the console port of a VMS system i.e. via a PCs serial port ? Steve ------------------------------ End of INFO-VAX 2007.102 ************************