INFO-VAX Sat, 24 Feb 2007 Volume 2007 : Issue 109 Contents: Re: A CEO agrees with me: Marketing! Re: Canadian OpenVMS Seminars (07.02.20 & 22) Re: Canadian OpenVMS Seminars (07.02.20 & 22) Re: Canadian OpenVMS Seminars (07.02.20 & 22) Re: Fiber connection problems with 1-GB HBA and 4-GB SAN Re: Is it possible to boot OpenVMS from an IDE disk on an ES40? Re: Is it possible to boot OpenVMS from an IDE disk on an ES40? Re: Is it possible to boot OpenVMS from an IDE disk on an ES40? Re: SYS$TIMEZONE_RULE problems ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Fri, 23 Feb 2007 21:13:17 -0600 From: David J Dachtera Subject: Re: A CEO agrees with me: Marketing! Message-ID: <45DFAD4D.CAB43AA5@spam.comcast.net> Bill Gunshannon wrote: > > In article <00A63AA0.0226759F@sendspamhere.org>, > VAXman- @SendSpamHere.ORG writes: > > In article , healyzh@aracnet.com writes: > >> > >> > >>Bob Koehler wrote: > >>> In article <00A639DD.F85718F7@SendSpamHere.ORG>, VAXman- > >>> @SendSpamHere.ORG writes: > >>> > > >>> > So Kraft Foods should buy OpenVMS! > >> > >>> You want an OS that tastes like Velveeta? > >> > >>Wouldn't that be Windows? > > > > Weendoze would be more like Swiss cheese! > > Are you sure it's not Limburger? I doubt Kraft's marketing people would ever see this ng, but they may find it interesting that "Kraft" is immediately associated with "Velveeta". Actually, I used to like my Mom's grilled Velveeta sandwiches on Friday during Lent, before we found out I was lipase deficient and lactose intolerant. -- David J Dachtera dba DJE Systems http://www.djesys.com/ Unofficial OpenVMS Marketing Home Page http://www.djesys.com/vms/market/ Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/ Unofficial OpenVMS-IA32 Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/ia32/ Unofficial OpenVMS Hobbyist Support Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/support/ ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 24 Feb 2007 01:28:25 GMT From: Tad Winters Subject: Re: Canadian OpenVMS Seminars (07.02.20 & 22) Message-ID: JF Mezei wrote in news:e550a$45df0b62$cef8887a$12205@TEKSAVVY.COM: > HP is consolidating about 85 data centres worldwide into 3 with 3 > others acting as backup. (so the numbe "6" is often mentioned). All > these 6 are in the southern USA, HP felt that this was the safest > place in terms of weather, availability of power , cooling etc. (I > think they forgot tornatoes, hurricanes, droughts etc that are common > to southern USA :-) > Strange. The northwest hasn't experienced any power issues in my memory. It doesn't get terribly hot or terribly cold when you're west of the Cascade mountain range. The last 2 major floods were 1996 and about 1900. Those who suffered damage in 1996 were located in areas I wouldn't have bothered to build. (Hey, even Google built a data center east of the Cascade mountain range, near the Columbia River.) ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 23 Feb 2007 21:42:11 -0500 From: JF Mezei Subject: Re: Canadian OpenVMS Seminars (07.02.20 & 22) Message-ID: Tad Winters wrote: > Strange. The northwest hasn't experienced any power issues in my memor= y. =20 > It doesn't get terribly hot or terribly cold when you're west of the=20 > Cascade mountain range. We can interpret HP's selection of sites in many ways. HP could have=20 located one site in Qu=E9bec right next to a power generating station.=20 Qu=E9bec's grid is separate from the others. (remember the northeast blac= kout=20 a few summers ago ?, quebec wasn't affected by that). And I am sure many people could pitch their own cities/areas as a perfect= =20 spot for a data centre. There are obviously many variables that must have come into play to skew = the decision on the data centre sites. The reasons given by the presenter= =20 didn't seem quite credible in term of justifying those locations. But there is one important aspect not to be overlooked. By building very = large data centres, HP is gaining expertise in this area and may adapt it= s=20 product suite to better suit large enterprise stuff. Remember that Digital had learned a lot from its own internal use of=20 systems on a large scale. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 24 Feb 2007 00:48:53 -0500 From: JF Mezei Subject: Re: Canadian OpenVMS Seminars (07.02.20 & 22) Message-ID: <808b7$45dfd1cd$cef8887a$13834@TEKSAVVY.COM> Finally. It is ready. The much promised pictures from the Toronto DECUS event held this past week. Those are not the official ones from Encompass. (although they have been given a copy of the raw unedited images). http://www.vaxination.ca/vms/decus/ is the place to go. If Dave Froble doesn't read this, his loss :-( ;-( When Sue proceeded to shut me up, it was on behalf of the comp.os.vms community. So she is the one to be thanked for what happened to me there. Enjoy :-) ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 23 Feb 2007 22:13:48 +0100 From: Dirk Munk Subject: Re: Fiber connection problems with 1-GB HBA and 4-GB SAN Message-ID: John wrote: > Compaq B series > with firmware version V2.6.2d That is the latest and the last version. This switch is end of life. > which is a Brocade 2800 - 1-GB SAN > attached is a DS10 - V7.3-2 with ECO Do a firmware update to update the system firmware (SRM etc.) as well as the fibrechannel adapter firmware (if you haven't done so yet) > > EMC DS-4100-B > latest version ? recently purchased If it has a 5.2 version firmware, then it is no longer compatible with the Brocade 2800. > which is a Brocade 4100 - 4-GB SAN > attached is an Adic Scalar i500 tape library Check the firmware of the Scalar as well for compatibility with the Brocade 4100. > > I have been able to connect the two SANs together - making sure all the > parameters are the same (credits, tov, core-PID, etc.) and unique domain > ID's. The link light comes on and the fabric is established. > Each SAN sees their respective components using the command nsShow > The 1-GB SAN sees the DS10 and the 4-GB SAN > The 4-GB SAN sees the Adic and the 1-GB SAN > (I do not know the command to scan all the WWID devices on the fabric) > > However from the DS10 I can not see the WWID of the Adic > > SYSMAN> IO FIND_WWID > IO FIND_WWID > %SYSMAN-I-OUTPUT, command execution on node VBUPSV > No previously undiscovered WWIDs have been found. > > SYSMAN> IO LIST_WWID > IO LIST_WWID > %SYSMAN-I-OUTPUT, command execution on node VBUPSV > > 1) Is the 1-GB HBA a problem? Firmware issue? Replacement? Missed an > ECO? > > 2) Or do I need to create the device using SYSMAN? > SYSMAN> IO CREATE_WWID /WWID=ww:"..." > > 3) What is the SAN command to scan for all WWID devices on the fabric? > > Thanks for your help! ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 23 Feb 2007 14:13:55 -0500 From: JF Mezei Subject: Re: Is it possible to boot OpenVMS from an IDE disk on an ES40? Message-ID: <7bc6b$45df3cfa$cef8887a$24355@TEKSAVVY.COM> Stephen Hoffman wrote: > Um, WRITEBOOT and SET BOOTBLOCK operate on references from LBN0 to > (in the case of OpenVMS Alpha) APB.EXE, and not on SYSBOOT.EXE. Thanks for the correction. > as APB.EXE is already looking around for the secondary bootfile. This > is the primitive file system and the console and related bootstrap > driver code that are in flight -- and failing -- here. If the initial reference to APB.EXE was correctly written to this disk, wouldn't there be some assumption that the rest of the disk would also be correctly loaded ? How was this particular device populated in the first place ? I remember my Vaxstation 3100 having problem with an old SCSI-1 disk. It would begin the boot, and then just hang because it was waiting for a SCSI response from a disk that didn't understand the question. Physically unplugging the power from drive and plugging it back in would clear the jam and allow the boot to continue. (and no problems after that). Is it possible that the "firmware" is able to access the device and begin the boot sequence, but that once the VMS drivers take over, it causes problems ? (remember that his IDE drive is emulated so perhaps VMS makes some slightly different IDE requests that his IDE emulator doesn't quite handle properly ? Note to the original poster: DS10 class machines have no problems booting from IDE drives. This is pretty standard. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 23 Feb 2007 14:40:15 -0500 From: Stephen Hoffman Subject: Re: Is it possible to boot OpenVMS from an IDE disk on an ES40? Message-ID: JF Mezei wrote: > Stephen Hoffman wrote: >> Um, WRITEBOOT and SET BOOTBLOCK operate on references from LBN0 to >> (in the case of OpenVMS Alpha) APB.EXE, and not on SYSBOOT.EXE. > > Thanks for the correction. > >> as APB.EXE is already looking around for the secondary bootfile. This >> is the primitive file system and the console and related bootstrap >> driver code that are in flight -- and failing -- here. > > If the initial reference to APB.EXE was correctly written to this disk, > wouldn't there be some assumption that the rest of the disk would also > be correctly loaded ? You can assume whatever you like, but didn't some local systems get scrozzled by some nasty evil corruptions not to long ago. > I remember my Vaxstation 3100 having problem with an old SCSI-1 disk. It > would begin the boot, and then just hang because it was waiting for a > SCSI response from a disk that didn't understand the question. > Physically unplugging the power from drive and plugging it back in would > clear the jam and allow the boot to continue. (and no problems after that). There are days I don't understand the question. Usually more coffee helps. But I digress. :-) There is a non-trivial difference from device to device, whether we are discussing SCSI controllers, SCSI disks, IDE bus interfaces, or ATA or ATAPI IDE targets. CD and DVD devices are particularly familiar, and I've yet to meet two that are identical. Some vendors are better than others here, but device-level compatibility is far from assured. Firmware-based devices such as SCSI disks can quite commonly head off into their own little world. But it's OK, the SCSI deities know them there. :-) Drivers can get confused. Firmware can get confused. The VAXstation 3100 series firmware some of the earliest-generation SCSI support in the product line, too. The old saw certainly applies: all usage of the term "compatible" to describe a widget should be interpreted as meaning "different", as if the widgets involved were truly identical, they would be referred to as being "identical". > Is it possible that the "firmware" is able to access the device and > begin the boot sequence, but that once the VMS drivers take over, it > causes problems ? (remember that his IDE drive is emulated so perhaps > VMS makes some slightly different IDE requests that his IDE emulator > doesn't quite handle properly ? The whole box is emulated. That is orders of magnitude larger than an emulated IDE ATA disk interface. This could be something in the structures leading back to the controller that's not quite right, or an instruction-level error, or most anything else that could conceivably be wrong with "hardware". APB has not gotten as far along as the "real" OpenVMS drivers here. APB and SYSBOOT both use APB-based drivers. Once SYSBOOT is rolling, then more advanced drivers are loaded and activated. -- www.HoffmanLabs.com Services for OpenVMS ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 23 Feb 2007 21:17:18 -0600 From: David J Dachtera Subject: Re: Is it possible to boot OpenVMS from an IDE disk on an ES40? Message-ID: <45DFAE3E.28841964@spam.comcast.net> Stephen Hoffman wrote: > [snip] > The whole box is emulated. > > That is orders of magnitude larger than an emulated IDE ATA disk > interface. This could be something in the structures leading back to > the controller that's not quite right, or an instruction-level error, or > most anything else that could conceivably be wrong with "hardware". > > APB has not gotten as far along as the "real" OpenVMS drivers here. > APB and SYSBOOT both use APB-based drivers. Once SYSBOOT is rolling, > then more advanced drivers are loaded and activated. What we sem to be overlooking here also is that WRITEBOOT enables the PRIMARY bootstrap to find APB (the SECONDARY bootstrap). However, APB can't find SYSBOOT (the tertiary bootstrap). So, something else is at work here. Possibly something not quite kosher in the IDE emulation. -- David J Dachtera dba DJE Systems http://www.djesys.com/ Unofficial OpenVMS Marketing Home Page http://www.djesys.com/vms/market/ Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/ Unofficial OpenVMS-IA32 Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/ia32/ Unofficial OpenVMS Hobbyist Support Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/support/ ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 23 Feb 2007 14:19:48 -0500 From: Stephen Hoffman Subject: Re: SYS$TIMEZONE_RULE problems Message-ID: healyzh@aracnet.com wrote: > Bill Hall wrote: >> Verify that you have a command procedure >> SYS$STARTUP:TDF$UTC_STARTUP.COM. If it doesn't exist, run >> UTC$TIME_SETUP.COM to create a new one. If it does exist, check the >> logic in the procedure. The logic may be "bad" if the procedure was >> created a long time ago and you have done DECnet/DTSS/UCX >> reconfigurations. If so, just delete TDF$UTC_STARTUP.COM and run >> TC$TIME_SETUP.COM to create a new one that should work. > > It is definitely possible that a reconfig is the problem. I originally had > the system running DECnet-Plus, and am now running DECnet Phase IV. > > After some more looking, it would appear that part of my problem is that > UTC$TIME_SETUP.COM itself expects DTSS to be installed as it calls > SYS$UPDATE:DTSS$INSTALL_TIMEZONE_RULE.COM (which does exist). FWIW, most of DECdts is built into OpenVMS starting with V7.3; that's how DST and the automatic switch-over and DST and TZ timekeeping is implemented. The DECdts time and timekeeping and time-conversion API -- which arrived in base OpenVMS at V7.3 -- was first documented starting around V8.2. Is NET$DISABLE_DTSS still defined somewhere? Do get the TZ and related ECOs loaded, as there have been bugs in this area. But regardless, I'd load the current DST and TZ ECO kits, and then re-run (interactively) the set-up: @SYS$MANAGER:UTC$TIME_SETUP The brute-force approach is probably: @SYS$MANAGER:UTC$TIME_SETUP "" RULE And RULE is a keyword here. -- www.HoffmanLabs.com Services for OpenVMS ------------------------------ End of INFO-VAX 2007.109 ************************