INFO-VAX Fri, 13 Apr 2007 Volume 2007 : Issue 204 Contents: Re: can you handle this? OpenVMS System Admin Job in Finance (Switzerland) Re: OT: 216 Billion Americans Squirrels Are Scientifically Illiterate (Part 36) Re: OT: 216 Billion Americans Squirrels Are Scientifically Illiterate (Part 36) Re: OT: 216 Billion Americans Squirrels Are Scientifically Illiterate (Part 36) Re: OT: 216 Billion Americans Squirrels Are Scientifically Illiterate (Part 36) Re: OT: 216 Billion Americans Squirrels Are Scientifically Illiterate (Part 36) Re: OT: 216 Billion Americans Squirrels Are Scientifically Illiterate (Part 36) OT: Sun shows Rock first silicon Re: OT: Sun shows Rock first silicon Re: Suitable news readers - Was: Re: COV: Re: Sun shows Rock first silicon Re: Sun shows Rock first silicon Re: Updated VMS Information (not to big) Re: VMS Alpha to Itanium port Re: VMS Alpha to Itanium port Re: VMS Alpha to Itanium port ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 13 Apr 2007 07:18:08 -0500 From: clubley@remove_me.eisner.decus.org-Earth.UFP (Simon Clubley) Subject: Re: can you handle this? Message-ID: In article <1176433286.892632.31110@y80g2000hsf.googlegroups.com>, genius@marblecliff.com writes: > that evolution has been exposed as the lie it is ... > > click on this link if you want answers ... > > http://www.answersingenesis.org/home/area/qa.asp > One more time Bob, Will you publish a valid email address so that those of us who wish to discuss this with you have the option of taking it to email instead of cluttering up COV. Thanks, Simon. -- Simon Clubley, clubley@remove_me.eisner.decus.org-Earth.UFP Microsoft: Bringing you 1980's technology to a 21st century world ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 13 Apr 2007 08:31:44 -0400 From: "Main, Kerry" Subject: OpenVMS System Admin Job in Finance (Switzerland) Message-ID: All - Reposted from Rdb newsgroup: From: VMS work [mailto:VMSwork@swissonline.ch]=20 Sent: Wednesday, April 11, 2007 3:07 PM To: VMSwork@swissonline.ch Subject: VMS job (contract/perm) VMS job opportunity at a leading global financial organisation for top of the range VMS System Managers: Required skills:=20 OpenVMS systems management, TCP/IP, DECnet administration. This is a non development role, needing a hands on approach. Experience in a high pressure and high responsibility production environment is a must, financial experience is desired! The successful candidate(s) will be familiar with OpenVMS installation and upgrade procedures, OpenVMS clustering, DECnet Phase V, TCP/IP services for OpenVMS, performance analysis, tuning and troubleshooting and day-to-day service delivery. Must be a real team-player and be able to work in an international team, respecting other cultures and customs, however English is the common language. =20 Nice to have:=20 Oracle Classic administration, Oracle RDB database administration, Manager/Oracle Database Administrator.=20 Location: Zurich, Switzerland Position: contract/permanent Rate: excellent, BUT based on experience and skill Start: ASAP=20 Language: English, a must (spoken and written) When applying for this role, please ensure VMS versions and hardware types are indicated in your CV/Resume. Please send your replies to VMSwork@swissonline.ch ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 13 Apr 2007 03:16:20 -0400 From: JF Mezei Subject: Re: OT: 216 Billion Americans Squirrels Are Scientifically Illiterate (Part 36) Message-ID: <9d76d$461f2e72$cef8887a$6000@TEKSAVVY.COM> Bill Todd wrote: > You can overdose (sometimes fatally) on common vitamins which in the > proper dosage are absolutely essential for good health, to take an > example from a different realm. and tOoMuChSeXmAkEsYoUrEyEsGoFuNnY It is now proven scientifically that we are emitting an unsustainable level of CO2. It is proven scientifically that temperatures rises in the last few decades do not match the natural trends. It is known that the next few degrees of rises are critical because they would not only start melting a lot of ice, but also unleash bilions and bilions of tons of CO2/methane stored in a thawing permafrost. It is an overdose of CO2 for the planet's thermal control system. It isn't sustainable, it MUST be reduced ASAP. It is that simple. ------------------------------ Date: 13 Apr 2007 03:07:53 -0700 From: "Andrew" Subject: Re: OT: 216 Billion Americans Squirrels Are Scientifically Illiterate (Part 36) Message-ID: <1176458873.797646.154600@o5g2000hsb.googlegroups.com> On 12 Apr, 23:36, "Dr. Dweeb" wrote: > Andrew wrote: > > On 11 Apr, 00:35, "Dr. Dweeb" wrote: > >> Bill Todd wrote: > >>> Bob Koehler wrote: > >>>> In article <56v7fnF29prb...@mid.individual.net>, b...@cs.uofs.edu > >>>> (Bill Gunshannon) writes: > >>>>> Supposedly, diesels polute less than cars. > > >>>> Burning less fuel gives them a significant advantage here. But > >>>> burning diesel fuel has caused them to emit much higher levels > >>>> of NO. Recent tehnoogy, including new fuel blends, have > >>>> significantly cut down the NO, but not as low as gas engines. > > >>> My dim recollection from around 40 years ago is that increased NO in > >>> gasoline engines is a by-product of higher compression ratios and, > >>> perhaps specifically, increases in 'quench area' used to make them > >>> feasible (by increasing turbulence just before combustion and thus > >>> better mixing the fuel and air). A quick look now does not make it > >>> clear whether the NO increase comes from compression ratio alone or > >>> is related to the relative coolness of the quench area during > >>> combustion (which was said to cause increases in other pollutants). > > >>> Since diesel engines run far higher compression ratios than gasoline > >>> engines, their NO problem may be to some degree endemic. > >>> Fortunately, exhaust processing seems to have been fairly effective > >>> in reducing NO at the tailpipe for gas engines, and presumably > >>> could work well for diesels too. > > >> IIRC the "environmental" issue with diesel engines is more with > >> "particulate mass" and its elimintaion than gas emissions (NO, CO2 > >> etc) > > >> C02 is not a pollutant, particulate mass is, and the stuff that > >> comes out of diesel engines is nasty stuff. > > > That's 1990's thinking or perhaps you could describe it as US > > thinking. Environmental science is changing all the time, CO2 has > > moved from being a benign side effect of burning fossil fuel to an > > environmental pollutant. Someone and it may have been you posted a > > reference to an organization that is still trying yo describe CO2 as a > > bountiful plant growth accelerator (only in the US). > > > The definition of Pollution is where something is where it is not > > supposed to be, and causes some sort of damage or problem. > > > Many naturally occurring substances are necessary in small quantities > > for life to occur, these same substances can cause serious problems in > > larger quantities. CO2 was considered benign we now know that in > > larger than normal quantities it isn't. > > > You are sort of right about Diesel. Older Diesel engines produce more > > particles and combined with higher Sulphur Diesel fuel do produce more > > pollutants (other than CO2) than petrol engines. > > > However low Sulphur Diesel and newer Diesel engine designs such as the > > latest Mercedes Diesel engines have reduced these emissions > > dramatically. > > Last time I looked, I was a major shareholder of a large fleet of Mercedes, > MAN, HINO etc diesel engined vehicles. This is an issue that transport > idustry has been following quite closely for many years. > > Newer fuels and better engines have reduced the size of the particulate > mass, not its toxicity, and in fact the smaller particles are a severe > problem, because larger particles tended to land somewhere and get washed > away, the smaller particles are pervasive and it is essentially impossible > to avoid them, short of living in a bubble Also, being smaller > (microscopic), they are more easily absorbed into biological organisms and > are for this reason even more problematic. > Again you seem to be slightly behind the times. Ford, Daimler, Renault and a number of other manufacturers have been fitting Diesel Particle Filters to their Diesel engined cars (Ford started doing this in 2003) the DPF's remove the Ultra Fine particles that you refer to and DPF manufacturers claim that Diesel exhaust gas treated with a DPF contains less particles than the background air column, in effect they are claiming that a Diesel fitted with a DPF cleans the air. http://www.dieselnet.com/papers/0209czerwinski/ > There have been various suggestions as to how to gather them so they are not > emitted, but one of the issues is that the container of material is so > severely toxic that there are in fact very few facilities capable of > correctly dealing with them. > Again this is also not correct the bulk of the particles are actually carbon and many of the particle filter designs include regeneration systems which destroy the particles captured in the filter. Having a regeneration system is one factor which increases the life of the DPF. > There is plenty of literature available on this matter that is not written > by marketing droids. In this case, less is not actually better. > Odd that your sources don't seem to be that accurate. Perhaps you should read more marketing literature!! Regards Andrew Harrison ------------------------------ Date: 13 Apr 2007 08:53:26 -0700 From: "Andrew" Subject: Re: OT: 216 Billion Americans Squirrels Are Scientifically Illiterate (Part 36) Message-ID: <1176479606.712523.30190@b75g2000hsg.googlegroups.com> On 12 Apr, 23:40, "Dr. Dweeb" wrote: > Richard B. gilbert wrote: > > Bob Koehler wrote: > >> In article <461c1f3a$0$7608$157c6...@dreader2.cybercity.dk>, "Dr. > >> Dweeb" writes: > >>> C02 is not a pollutant, particulate mass is, and the stuff that > >>> comes out of diesel engines is nasty stuff. > > >> As the Supreme Court just informed the White House and the rest > >> of us have known all along, CO2 is a polutant. > > > When you equip yourself with a pollution control system to depollute > > your own exhalations, we might take you seriously! > > Someone has calculated the volume of CO2 exhaled by biological organisms, > but I cannot bebothered to find it just now. It is of course substantial. > Of course thats screamingly obvious its all part of the carbon cycle and its why we exist at all. > Obviously, the screaming alarmists that pervade this board do not rate > highly with me. > Clearly, its just a shame that you have failed to produce any credible evidence to counter the "screaming alarmists" and since this is the case one has to conclude that the "screaming alarmists" arn't alarmist at all. > I think CO2, technically, is from an atmospheric perspective a trace gas. > I am not quite sure what you intended by this comment but yes you are correct CO2 only accounts for a very small % of our atmosphere. Just in case your comment was intended to imply that because CO2 is a trace gas that its effects cannot be anything like as severe as people suggest let me remind you that even the anti-humans activities causing global warming camp have had to conclude that increased levels of CO2 will cause warming. just so you have some number to play with rather than a rather vague "trace" pre large scale industrialization the concentrations of CO2 in the atmosphere were around 280 ppm, this has now risen to about 380 ppm. The IPPC report concludes that CO2 is likely to hit the 650 - 800 ppm levels by 2100. Causing a 2-5 degree rise in average global temperatures. regards Andrew ------------------------------ Date: 13 Apr 2007 08:54:23 -0700 From: "Andrew" Subject: Re: OT: 216 Billion Americans Squirrels Are Scientifically Illiterate (Part 36) Message-ID: <1176479663.622211.327010@o5g2000hsb.googlegroups.com> On 12 Apr, 19:32, "Tom Linden" wrote: > On Thu, 12 Apr 2007 08:55:14 -0700, Dale E. Coy > > > > wrote: > > > "Dr. Dweeb" wrote in message > >news:461c1f3a$0$7608$157c6196@dreader2.cybercity.dk... > > .... > > >> IIRC the "environmental" issue with diesel engines is more with > >> "particulate mass" and its elimintaion than gas emissions (NO, CO2 etc) > > >> C02 is not a pollutant, particulate mass is, and the stuff that comes > >> out > >> of diesel engines is nasty stuff. > > >> Dweeb. > > >>> - bill > > > Isn't CO2 listed as a "greenhouse gas"? > > so is H2O greenhouse gas ^= pollutant. Indeed without greenhouse gases > life > might not be sustainable. > Of course ever heard of the carbon cycle. > -- > Using Opera's revolutionary e-mail client:http://www.opera.com/mail/ ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 13 Apr 2007 08:58:00 -0700 From: "Tom Linden" Subject: Re: OT: 216 Billion Americans Squirrels Are Scientifically Illiterate (Part 36) Message-ID: On Fri, 13 Apr 2007 00:16:20 -0700, JF Mezei wrote: > Bill Todd wrote: >> You can overdose (sometimes fatally) on common vitamins which in the >> proper dosage are absolutely essential for good health, to take an >> example from a different realm. > > and tOoMuChSeXmAkEsYoUrEyEsGoFuNnY > > It is now proven scientifically that we are emitting an unsustainable > level of CO2. It is proven scientifically that temperatures rises in the > last few decades do not match the natural trends. It is known that the > next few degrees of rises are critical because they would not only start > melting a lot of ice, but also unleash bilions and bilions of tons of > CO2/methane stored in a thawing permafrost. It is not at all proven, and this is a total misreading of the scientific data. This is my last post on this off-topic > > It is an overdose of CO2 for the planet's thermal control system. It > isn't sustainable, it MUST be reduced ASAP. It is that simple. -- Using Opera's revolutionary e-mail client: http://www.opera.com/mail/ ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 13 Apr 2007 02:25:35 -0400 From: Bill Todd Subject: Re: OT: 216 Billion Americans Squirrels Are Scientifically Illiterate (Part 36) Message-ID: Tom Linden wrote: > On Thu, 12 Apr 2007 08:55:14 -0700, Dale E. Coy > wrote: > >> >> "Dr. Dweeb" wrote in message >> news:461c1f3a$0$7608$157c6196@dreader2.cybercity.dk... >> .... >> >>> IIRC the "environmental" issue with diesel engines is more with >>> "particulate mass" and its elimintaion than gas emissions (NO, CO2 etc) >>> >>> C02 is not a pollutant, particulate mass is, and the stuff that comes >>> out >>> of diesel engines is nasty stuff. >>> >>> Dweeb. >>> >>>> - bill >>> >> >> Isn't CO2 listed as a "greenhouse gas"? >> > so is H2O greenhouse gas ^= pollutant. Indeed without greenhouse gases > life > might not be sustainable. And with too much greenhouse gas life isn't sustainable either - look to Venus for one example. As I said (and as no one has come up with one whit of reasonable refutation for), it's *excess* that's the problem and which effectively changes something 'good' (benefit) into something 'bad' (pollutant). You can overdose (sometimes fatally) on common vitamins which in the proper dosage are absolutely essential for good health, to take an example from a different realm. It doesn't matter that *some* of our atmospheric CO2 (and even some of the increase in it, or for that matter even *much* of the increase in it) may be coming from natural sources: if we see it heading for levels with potentially serious climatic consequences (even if some or even *much* of that increase may be due to natural mechanisms), and if our own contribution is high enough that reducing it could significantly reduce the impact of such climate changes, *that's* what's relevant. In other words, from a practical viewpoint this is far less about who's to blame (much as those opposed to doing anything might wish to divert discussion into such rat-holes) than it is about averting potential disaster regardless of its cause. Only if reducing out own contributions couldn't noticeably affect the situation does this cease to be an issue of responsibility to our successors not to rape the planet for our own convenience and to their significant detriment (though we would still retain additional responsibilities relating to depletion of irreplaceable, non-renewable resources). - bill ------------------------------ Date: 13 Apr 2007 06:19:15 -0700 From: "Andrew" Subject: OT: Sun shows Rock first silicon Message-ID: <1176470355.483306.114870@d57g2000hsg.googlegroups.com> After quietly announcing 1.95Ghz and 2.1Ghz Dual Core UltraSPARC IV+ modules Sun have show pictures of the first Rock Silicon along with a claim that these are working chips. http://www.theregister.co.uk/2007/04/10/sun_rock_schwartz/ These announcements come at a good time for Sun after recent reports of delays to the release of Power 6 from IBM though an expected early or on time delivery of Rock may weaken sales of the servers Sun has developed with Fujitsu which are due for release next week. Regards Andrew Harrison ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 13 Apr 2007 17:39:34 +0000 (UTC) From: Rick Jones Subject: Re: OT: Sun shows Rock first silicon Message-ID: Andrew wrote: > After quietly announcing 1.95Ghz and 2.1Ghz Dual Core UltraSPARC IV+ > modules Sun have show pictures of the first Rock Silicon along with > a claim that these are working chips. > http://www.theregister.co.uk/2007/04/10/sun_rock_schwartz/ Working as in "The chips are running billions of instructions already (not quite at Hello, World, but not far away)." So, probably not a full boot of an OS to a login prompt just yet... Of course, "billions of instructions" at today's frequencies isn't all that long a runtime :) rick jones -- The glass is neither half-empty nor half-full. The glass has a leak. The real question is "Can it be patched?" these opinions are mine, all mine; HP might not want them anyway... :) feel free to post, OR email to rick.jones2 in hp.com but NOT BOTH... ------------------------------ Date: 13 Apr 2007 06:16:11 -0700 From: "johnhreinhardt@yahoo.com" Subject: Re: Suitable news readers - Was: Re: COV: Message-ID: <1176470171.671321.272620@b75g2000hsg.googlegroups.com> On Apr 12, 9:24 pm, ditt...@dittman.net wrote: > johnhreinha...@yahoo.com wrote: > > On Mar 28, 3:15 pm, Paul Sture wrote: > > > In article , heal...@aracnet.com wrote: > > > > Paul Sture wrote: > > > > > I was using them until about a year ago, and don't remember any > > > > > performance problems. I did however find that the Mac version of Opera > > > > > was unacceptably slow for news reading. > > > > > I've found that the state of GUI based newsreaders on the Mac is uniformly > > > > bad. They all seem to have at least one thing that I dislike. Sadly this > > > > is one area where I consider Windows to easily beat the Mac. However, since > > > > you can run Unix applications, you do have access to some nice terminal > > > > based newsreaders. > > > > Understood. Now if I could find a better terminal emulator for OS X ... > > > > -- > > > Paul Sture > > One that recognizes ALL of the keys on a LK463 would be nice, too... > > Unfortunately the USB driver in OS X strips out some of the keycodes sent by > the LK463. > -- > Eric Dittman > ditt...@dittman.net Yes, I know. I've been looking at the Darwin source and hoping it was an easy change to make. I've seen several keyboard manufacturers provide alternate OS X keyboard drivers (Microsoft, Kensington, Macally) so I know it's possible. I just don't currently have the skillset to do it. Yet. I may play with it though as time permits (Hopefully before 10.4.10[A - whatever Apple decides to call it] or Leopard comes out). John H. Reinhardt ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 13 Apr 2007 09:54:53 -0700 From: "Malcolm Dunnett" Subject: Re: Sun shows Rock first silicon Message-ID: <461fb58b$1@flight> "Andrew" wrote in message news:1176470355.483306.114870@d57g2000hsg.googlegroups.com... > > After quietly announcing 1.95Ghz and 2.1Ghz Dual Core UltraSPARC IV+ > modules Sun have show pictures of the first Rock Silicon along with a > claim that these are working chips. > Wonderful, how well do they run VMS? ------------------------------ Date: 13 Apr 2007 17:38:21 GMT From: bill@cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon) Subject: Re: Sun shows Rock first silicon Message-ID: <589tgdF2fdm4cU1@mid.individual.net> In article <461fb58b$1@flight>, "Malcolm Dunnett" writes: > "Andrew" wrote in message > news:1176470355.483306.114870@d57g2000hsg.googlegroups.com... >> >> After quietly announcing 1.95Ghz and 2.1Ghz Dual Core UltraSPARC IV+ >> modules Sun have show pictures of the first Rock Silicon along with a >> claim that these are working chips. >> > > Wonderful, how well do they run VMS? Who's fault is it that they don't? bill -- Bill Gunshannon | de-moc-ra-cy (di mok' ra see) n. Three wolves bill@cs.scranton.edu | and a sheep voting on what's for dinner. University of Scranton | Scranton, Pennsylvania | #include ------------------------------ Date: 13 Apr 2007 01:31:43 -0700 From: "Ian Miller" Subject: Re: Updated VMS Information (not to big) Message-ID: <1176453103.611369.51670@l77g2000hsb.googlegroups.com> On Apr 12, 7:50 pm, "Tom Linden" wrote: > a fortiori, that VMS doesn't have a similar facility to Tru64 permitting > the show and set of console variables, consvar > See default_boot.c http://groups.google.com/group/comp.os.vms/msg/5d0da9dace8ab022 ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 13 Apr 2007 09:12:44 +0200 From: Michael Unger Subject: Re: VMS Alpha to Itanium port Message-ID: <588p6uF2f6resU1@mid.individual.net> On 2007-04-12 23:45, "VAXman- @SendSpamHere.ORG" wrote: > It might be good but not usefull... ppt! > > Any PDF? Check your mailbox ... Michael -- Real names enhance the probability of getting real answers. My e-mail account at DECUS Munich is no longer valid. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 13 Apr 2007 09:14:38 GMT From: "Colin Butcher" Subject: Re: VMS Alpha to Itanium port Message-ID: <2SHTh.957$Ro3.373@text.news.blueyonder.co.uk> It depends where you're located, but this might be useful to you as well: http://h71000.www7.hp.com/new/hpugmig.html -- Cheers, Colin. Legacy = Stuff that works properly! ------------------------------ Date: 13 Apr 2007 08:22:49 -0700 From: davidc@montagar.com Subject: Re: VMS Alpha to Itanium port Message-ID: <1176477769.767542.104630@q75g2000hsh.googlegroups.com> On Apr 12, 1:56 pm, "Chris Townley" wrote: > Just suddenly had the concept of porting a legacy in house application > from Alpha to Integrity given to me. I would guess that you will have few problems. I've ported C from Windows/Linux that I wrote to OpenVMS IA64 with little problem (of course, I wrote it explicitly with portability in mind), and some old VAX FORTRAN to IA64 with little problem once the magic qualifiers were identified. I would expect BASIC from Alpha to IA64 should be clean, too, especially if you are using standard language features. The C will probably be okay. The only wild-card that I'd be concerned about is MACRO, but Alpha to IA64 will likely be much less trouble than a VAX to IA64 would be. ------------------------------ End of INFO-VAX 2007.204 ************************