INFO-VAX Sat, 09 Jun 2007 Volume 2007 : Issue 313 Contents: Re: %TCPIP-E-ROUTEERROR from TCPIP SHOW ROUTES... Re: ALPHA_V732_MASTER_ECO_LIST.txt Re: Bandwidth Test Re: Bandwidth Test Re: Bandwidth Test Re: Bandwidth Test Re: Bandwidth Test Re: Bandwidth Test Re: cifs and external auth Re: cifs and external auth Re: cifs and external auth Re: cifs and external auth Re: cifs and external auth Re: cifs and external auth Re: cifs and external auth Re: Comparative patch installation (was Re: Re: Comparative patch installation (was Re: Re: Comparative patch installation (was Re: Re: Comparative patch installation (was Re: Re: Comparative patch installation (was Re: Re: Global warming NOT causing more hurricanes UK scientists say Re: Global warming NOT causing more hurricanes UK scientists say Re: Global warming NOT causing more hurricanes UK scientists say Re: Global warming NOT causing more hurricanes UK scientists say Re: HOWTO: Ignoring wildly OT threads Re: HOWTO: Ignoring wildly OT threads Re: HOWTO: Ignoring wildly OT threads Re: HOWTO: Ignoring wildly OT threads Re: HOWTO: Ignoring wildly OT threads Re: HP wasting millions of dollars on itanium! Re: HP wasting millions of dollars on itanium! Re: Ignoring password history when previous expires/setting expiration time ti Re: Ignoring password history when previous expires/setting expiration time OT: Question to Bob Re: OT: Question to Bob Re: OT: Question to Bob Re: OT: Question to Bob Re: OT: Question to Bob Out of office messages! Re: porting ignorance (was Re: Story Time) Re: porting ignorance (was Re: Story Time) Re: porting ignorance (was Re: Story Time) Re: porting ignorance (was Re: Story Time) Re: Restoring an IMAGE backup to a BIND volume set ? Re: Restoring an IMAGE backup to a BIND volume set ? Re: SECURITY.AUDIT$JOURNAL and ERRLOG.SYS Re: Story Time RE: Story Time Re: Story Time Re: Story Time Re: Story Time Re: Story Time U160 Raid Ctr Special for June 07 Re: using RBLs interactively Re: using RBLs interactively Re: using RBLs interactively world priv on sysuaf account Re: world priv on sysuaf account Re: world priv on sysuaf account Re: world priv on sysuaf account [Q]Pascal packed arrary of char and varying of char Re: [Q]Pascal packed arrary of char and varying of char ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Fri, 08 Jun 2007 15:00:21 -0400 From: JF Mezei Subject: Re: %TCPIP-E-ROUTEERROR from TCPIP SHOW ROUTES... Message-ID: <41211$4669a77c$cef8887a$19999@TEKSAVVY.COM> Galen wrote: > The only file it accessed before the error was UCX$IPC_SHR and that > succeeded. It doesn't even attempt to access TCPIP$HOST. If this not is not in a cluster, then I would suggest you zap its tcpip$configuration.dat and use tcpip$config to get it back up. (the other files such as tcpip$services can be left). If this is part of a cluster, it is a little different. You need to edit tcpip$configuration and delete all records associated with that node. The key is 4 binary bytes, so you need to do some homework to find out which records belong to which node and which belong to all nodes). ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 8 Jun 2007 19:59:58 +0000 (UTC) From: helbig@astro.multiCLOTHESvax.de (Phillip Helbig---remove CLOTHES to reply) Subject: Re: ALPHA_V732_MASTER_ECO_LIST.txt Message-ID: In article <1181306291.602139.49570@k79g2000hse.googlegroups.com>, "george.pagliarulo@hp.com" writes: > I'm responsible for the patch process. I thought it was best to > answer all this in the form of an FAQ. Thanks; much appreciated! > *Can patch lists in the UPDATE kits and master lists say which kits > were not in the previous UPDATE kit? > Absolutely, good idea. What I will do on future UPDATE kits is to add > an asterisk to the patch kit name if that patch was not in the > previous UPDATE kit. Great. I am normally up-to-date. But, if I come back from holiday, say, and see some new patches AND a new update kit, it's nice to see whether all the new patches are in the update kit (this is not always the case). (Someone pointed out that there has never been a patch in an update kit which was not released individually first; can one count on this?) Thus, in such cases I could install just the update kit. > *Why are there still UPDATE kits for V7.3-2. Because I'm still using it! :-) > At the time the VMS732_UPDATE-V1100 kit came out, the official plans > were to make that the last UPDATE kit for V7.3-2. Right. I think this was even documented. > *Why are UPDATE kits required kits? > > A little history here. We often send out patch kits that have > dependencies on other patch kits. Before UPDATE kits , these > dependencies, over time, would get unmanageable - Kit A requires Kit > B, Kit B does not require kit A but Kit A does require Kit C which > now, since Kit B requires Kit A, it also now requires Kit C > but.....you get the idea. UPDATE kits were started as a way to set a > new patch baseline and eliminate all those dependencies. To > accomplish this, once an UPDATE kit ships it beccomes a required kit > for any patch kit that is produced after the release of the UPDATE > kit. There is one caveat - when we started regularly scheduled > releases of UPDATE kits we changed the requirement policy. Now, patch > kits that require a reboot will require the latest UPDATE kit. Patch > kits that do not require a reboot will require the UPDATE kit released > before the latest kit. This is to try and help customers avoid an > unnecessary reboot if they haven't yet installed the latest kit. Good idea. > *Why can't UPDATE kits only install what has not yet been installed > with individual patch kits? > > The UPDATE kits set a baseline patch level. Without installing > everything in the UPDATE kit we really have no assurance that the > baseline has been set. With that said, two things were mentioned - > marking the database that an image has already been installed. As Norm > has mentioned, forget it, it's too difficult from an engineering > standpoint. You are talking a major rewrite of the PCSI facility. > It's not that it is difficult, there is not enough payback for such an > investment of resources. The other option is to do something within > the patch itself. I actually built a test UPDATE kit that checked to > see what had already been installed and did not reinstall those > images. I installed it on a system with no previous patches and on a > system with all the previous patches installed. I purposely used a > version (I think it was V7.3-2) that had a lot of patches against it; > my expectation being that there would be a significant reduction in > installation time. There was almost none and for that reason and > becuse of the baseline thing, I abandoned this idea. OK. But is it correct that if a NEWER version is installed, the one from the patch isn't (makes sense), but if the SAME version is installed, it is (doesn't hurt, but not necessary; maybe not a significant reduction in time, but if you have checked anyway)? (Of course, if the version from the update kit is newer, it gets installed.) > If a patch kit is contains an image that is the same version, or > later, as the image in an already installed patch kit, the image will > be installed. If the image in the new kit is older, the image in the > new kit will not be installed. If PCSI has no way of knowing, e.g. > the image on the system is an engineering test image, and does not > have the needed data in the image header, the image in the patch kit > will be installed, wiping out the older, questionable image. There is > a warning in the patch docmentation about this. OK, but why >= instead of >? ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 08 Jun 2007 18:16:30 GMT From: Tad Winters Subject: Re: Bandwidth Test Message-ID: "Tom Linden" wrote in news:op.ttlunzgsbuo9i0@murphus: > There are numerous sites that allow one to measure up and down link > speeds using a browser, of course. Any tools available to do the same > from DCL? Or perhaps an executable? > > Tom > Years ago, I used a program called iperf to completely load a T3 connection to verify its bandwidth. The network guys had tools to monitor the throughput at that time. However, a quick google search reveals what appears to be a more complete tool, as source code. It might be worth a check. (The old tool required the component on both ends, but maybe you can arrange that.) ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 08 Jun 2007 15:10:02 -0400 From: JF Mezei Subject: Re: Bandwidth Test Message-ID: Tom Linden wrote: > There are numerous sites that allow one to measure up and down link speeds > using a browser, of course. Any tools available to do the same from DCL? > Or perhaps an executable? I have not found any java test which works on VMS. Besides, I would expect the java to be the bottleneck, not the tcpip link :-) I use $show time $fetch_http nla0: -b $show time This gives me the HTTP response header with the file size. And I then calculate the speed based on the delta time from the 2 times shown. These bandwidth tests download pretty simple files. For instance: in this case, you can fetch http://speedtest.teksavvy.com/6000k I haven't yet found out how these guys test the other direction though. (this is a pretty standard java test that is fairly widely used by many ISPs). ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 8 Jun 2007 19:27:49 +0000 (UTC) From: Rick Jones Subject: Re: Bandwidth Test Message-ID: Tom Linden wrote: > There are numerous sites that allow one to measure up and down link > speeds using a browser, of course. Any tools available to do the > same from DCL? Or perhaps an executable? At one point, netperf (www.netperf.org) would compile and run under VMS. Might be a bit of bit-rot there at this point, but it shouldn't be tooo bad. Anyway, I'd be happy to work with folks wanting to get it running again - I know netperf, but don't know VMS. Normally, like iperf (mentioned elsewhere), netperf requires something at both ends. However, the 2.4.3 version has support for a "no control" option which can be combined with specifying the remote IP and port for the data connection to connect to say a chargen, discard or echo service, should such a thing be available on the remote. rick jones mr netperf -- The glass is neither half-empty nor half-full. The glass has a leak. The real question is "Can it be patched?" these opinions are mine, all mine; HP might not want them anyway... :) feel free to post, OR email to rick.jones2 in hp.com but NOT BOTH... ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 8 Jun 2007 20:08:32 +0000 (UTC) From: helbig@astro.multiCLOTHESvax.de (Phillip Helbig---remove CLOTHES to reply) Subject: Re: Bandwidth Test Message-ID: In article , "Tom Linden" writes: > There are numerous sites that allow one to measure up and down link speeds > using a browser, of course. Any tools available to do the same from DCL? > Or perhaps an executable? FTP? The browser sites depend very much on the browser! However you measure it, you need to make sure that the bottleneck is the connection speed, and not something else. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 08 Jun 2007 17:41:25 -0700 From: dooleys@snowy.net.au Subject: Re: Bandwidth Test Message-ID: <1181349685.088956.119510@d30g2000prg.googlegroups.com> On Jun 8, 11:34 pm, "Tom Linden" wrote: > There are numerous sites that allow one to measure up and down link speeds > using a browser, of course. Any tools available to do the same from DCL? > Or perhaps an executable? > > Tom > > -- > PL/I for OpenVMSwww.kednos.com if you can run it at both ends then you can use ttcp from the command prompt Phil ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 08 Jun 2007 19:55:42 -0700 From: "Tom Linden" Subject: Re: Bandwidth Test Message-ID: On Fri, 08 Jun 2007 17:41:25 -0700, wrote: > On Jun 8, 11:34 pm, "Tom Linden" wrote: >> There are numerous sites that allow one to measure up and down link >> speeds >> using a browser, of course. Any tools available to do the same from >> DCL? >> Or perhaps an executable? >> >> Tom >> >> -- >> PL/I for OpenVMSwww.kednos.com > if you can run it at both ends > then you can use ttcp from the command prompt Can't. > Phil > -- PL/I for OpenVMS www.kednos.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 08 Jun 2007 14:07:24 -0400 From: "Richard B. Gilbert" Subject: Re: cifs and external auth Message-ID: <46699ADC.5080500@comcast.net> VAXman- wrote: > In article , "Jerry Alan Braga" writes: > >> >>Will the production release of cifs support extauth like pathworks does ? >>The reason I ask is that I know pathworks is now a eof product and would > I don't know the answer to your question but where is the download for CIFS > (SAMBA) in the HP site. There is plenty of mention but I've been searching > around the VMS page since I awoke this morning looking for the download. I > really really really do not like HP pages. > > Anybody who knows where/how to find it, please provide the URL or a hint to > locating it. > > Thanks. The HP search engine sucks. I feel I need a stronger word than "sucks" but I can't think of one! Don't waste your time! Google for "Samba VMS download site:hp.com" ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 08 Jun 2007 18:54:25 GMT From: VAXman- @SendSpamHere.ORG Subject: Re: cifs and external auth Message-ID: <00A68D65.5ECB844D@SendSpamHere.ORG> In article <1181322744.283272.51270@g4g2000hsf.googlegroups.com>, IanMiller writes: > > >you can not dowload the HP CIFS for VMS kit at present. They have >taken away the evaluation kits and the field test kit is not yet >available. >As soon as I know its available there will be an announcement on >www.openvms.org I want the eval to test. In fact, I had it scheduled for this WE. -- VAXman- A Bored Certified VMS Kernel Mode Hacker VAXman(at)TMESIS(dot)COM "Well my son, life is like a beanstalk, isn't it?" ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 08 Jun 2007 19:02:06 GMT From: VAXman- @SendSpamHere.ORG Subject: Re: cifs and external auth Message-ID: <00A68D66.71A3B865@SendSpamHere.ORG> In article , "P. Sture" writes: > > >In article <00A68D53.AE13E39F@SendSpamHere.ORG>, > VAXman- @SendSpamHere.ORG wrote: > >> In article , "Jerry Alan Braga" >> writes: >> > >> > >> >Will the production release of cifs support extauth like pathworks does ? >> >The reason I ask is that I know pathworks is now a eof product and would >> >like to move to something more lightweight but I need the extauth against >> >our windows AD domain. I have installed the latest kit on a test box and I >> >have been able to have it connect to my windows 2003 AD domain but I do not >> >see anything about the extauth in it. >> > >> >Does the new acme ldap module with vms 8.3 do the same or do I need to look >> >into something like the process software version. I read up on the new acme >> >ldap that comes with 8.3 as a patch kit but it talks about a memory leak and >> >I am not ok with that in a production env. >> >> I don't know the answer to your question but where is the download for CIFS >> (SAMBA) in the HP site. There is plenty of mention but I've been searching >> around the VMS page since I awoke this morning looking for the download. I >> really really really do not like HP pages. >> >> Anybody who knows where/how to find it, please provide the URL or a hint to >> locating it. >> > >I bookmarked the following link when I downloaded it last October. It >still works. > >http://h71000.www7.hp.com/network/cifs_download.html > >But the file which downloads is the same as I have already: The Alpha >version is: > > hp-axpvms-samba-e0300-10e003-1.pcsi$compressed_sfx_axpexe > >10.2 MB, dated 19-OCT-2006 > >-- >Paul Sture Paul, you're a life saver. I owe you a beer or three. Until we meet, please enjoy this virtual beer: http://auralmoon.com/forum/images/smilies/drink.gif -- VAXman- A Bored Certified VMS Kernel Mode Hacker VAXman(at)TMESIS(dot)COM "Well my son, life is like a beanstalk, isn't it?" ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 08 Jun 2007 19:06:46 GMT From: VAXman- @SendSpamHere.ORG Subject: Re: cifs and external auth Message-ID: <00A68D67.18A3DE68@SendSpamHere.ORG> In article <46699ADC.5080500@comcast.net>, "Richard B. Gilbert" writes: >{...snip...} > >The HP search engine sucks. I feel I need a stronger word than "sucks" >but I can't think of one! Don't waste your time! Google for >"Samba VMS download site:hp.com" HP's search engine is _H_opelessly _P_athetic! Seriously, lately I've taken to labelling something not quite as sucky as Micro$hit as HP. -- VAXman- A Bored Certified VMS Kernel Mode Hacker VAXman(at)TMESIS(dot)COM "Well my son, life is like a beanstalk, isn't it?" ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 08 Jun 2007 23:03:38 +0200 From: "P. Sture" Subject: Re: cifs and external auth Message-ID: In article <00A68D67.18A3DE68@SendSpamHere.ORG>, VAXman- @SendSpamHere.ORG wrote: > In article <46699ADC.5080500@comcast.net>, "Richard B. Gilbert" > writes: > >{...snip...} > > > >The HP search engine sucks. I feel I need a stronger word than "sucks" > >but I can't think of one! Don't waste your time! Google for > >"Samba VMS download site:hp.com" > > HP's search engine is _H_opelessly _P_athetic! Seriously, lately I've > taken to labelling something not quite as sucky as Micro$hit as HP. An idea worth porting to VMS? Proposed EDT / TPU /LSE plug in: +---------------------------------------------+ | ___ | | / \ | | | | | | @ @ | | || || | | || || | | |\__/| | | \____/ | | | | It looks like you are writing a complaint. | | Do you need some help with that? | +---------------------------------------------+ (idea shamelessly nicked from ) -- Paul Sture ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 08 Jun 2007 23:06:34 +0200 From: "P. Sture" Subject: Re: cifs and external auth Message-ID: In article <46699ADC.5080500@comcast.net>, "Richard B. Gilbert" wrote: > VAXman- wrote: > > In article , "Jerry Alan Braga" > > writes: > > > >> > >>Will the production release of cifs support extauth like pathworks does ? > >>The reason I ask is that I know pathworks is now a eof product and would > > > I don't know the answer to your question but where is the download for CIFS > > (SAMBA) in the HP site. There is plenty of mention but I've been searching > > around the VMS page since I awoke this morning looking for the download. I > > really really really do not like HP pages. > > > > Anybody who knows where/how to find it, please provide the URL or a hint to > > locating it. > > > > Thanks. > > The HP search engine sucks. I feel I need a stronger word than "sucks" > but I can't think of one! Don't waste your time! Google for > "Samba VMS download site:hp.com" That is also a good tip for other sites which are hard to navigate. It works a treat for my local town hall's site, for example. -- Paul Sture ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 08 Jun 2007 23:45:21 +0200 From: "P. Sture" Subject: Re: cifs and external auth Message-ID: In article <00A68D66.71A3B865@SendSpamHere.ORG>, VAXman- @SendSpamHere.ORG wrote: > Paul, you're a life saver. I owe you a beer or three. Until we meet, please > enjoy this virtual beer: http://auralmoon.com/forum/images/smilies/drink.gif You are welcome. The virtual beer is _very_ appropriate, as I'm on pain killers at the moment :-) -- Paul Sture ------------------------------ Date: 8 Jun 2007 19:22:15 -0500 From: koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) Subject: Re: Comparative patch installation (was Re: Message-ID: In article <466898C8.B779BA4E@spam.comcast.net>, David J Dachtera writes: > Ron Johnson wrote: >> >> You know... installing "patches" in Linux is a *lot* simpler. > > You're joking, right? No he's serious. Patching Linux goes something like this: 1) identify bug 2) identify which application has the bug 3) search for the source for a functionally equivalent version of the application 4) study the source for a while 5) change the source to fix the bug 6) built, test, repeat How much simpler could it be? (Bought RedHat. Bought RedHat support. Never got a single bug fix via their automated update tool.) ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 08 Jun 2007 21:34:16 -0400 From: JF Mezei Subject: Re: Comparative patch installation (was Re: Message-ID: Question: What percentage of shops running Linux in production have not only the sources for all the stuff that came with Linux but also the tools to build executables ? If only a very small percentage of Linux shops have the tools needed to change the source and rebuild the faulty executable to put into production, then the ability for a shop to make their own fixes to Linux is only theoretical. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 08 Jun 2007 22:59:39 -0500 From: Ron Johnson Subject: Re: Comparative patch installation (was Re: Message-ID: On 06/08/07 19:22, Bob Koehler wrote: > In article <466898C8.B779BA4E@spam.comcast.net>, David J Dachtera > writes: >> Ron Johnson wrote: >>> You know... installing "patches" in Linux is a *lot* simpler. >>> >> You're joking, right? > > No he's serious. Patching Linux goes something like this: > > 1) identify bug You do that no matter which OS you run. > 2) identify which application has the bug You do that no matter which OS you run. > 3) search for the source for a functionally equivalent version of > the application This is 2007, not 1997. > 4) study the source for a while This is 2007, not 1997. > 5) change the source to fix the bug This is 2007, not 1997. > 6) built, test, repeat This is 2007, not 1997. Unless you are a distro. I haven't *had* to build new software in years. (Ever since I was using Mandrake.) > How much simpler could it be? (Bought RedHat. Bought RedHat > support. Never got a single bug fix via their automated update > tool.) You must have set up something wrong. But then, maybe not. Anyway I use Debian, and there's a definite stream of security fixes flowing into v4.0 ("stable"). -- Ron Johnson, Jr. Jefferson LA USA Give a man a fish, and he eats for a day. Hit him with a fish, and he goes away for good! ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 09 Jun 2007 00:16:21 -0400 From: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Arne_Vajh=F8j?= Subject: Re: Comparative patch installation (was Re: Message-ID: <466a2990$0$90274$14726298@news.sunsite.dk> Bob Koehler wrote: > How much simpler could it be? (Bought RedHat. Bought RedHat > support. Never got a single bug fix via their automated update tool.) Mysterious. I my experience up2date works very nicely. Arne ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 09 Jun 2007 00:20:51 -0400 From: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Arne_Vajh=F8j?= Subject: Re: Comparative patch installation (was Re: Message-ID: <466a2aa0$0$90274$14726298@news.sunsite.dk> JF Mezei wrote: > Question: > > What percentage of shops running Linux in production have not only the > sources for all the stuff that came with Linux but also the tools to > build executables ? > > If only a very small percentage of Linux shops have the tools needed to > change the source and rebuild the faulty executable to put into > production, then the ability for a shop to make their own fixes to > Linux is only theoretical. Most neither has the skills nor any interest in doing so. But there are a group of volunteers and there are some companies with commercial interest in Linux (IBM, Redhat, Oracle, Novell etc.) that do use the possibility. The end users advantage is that thery are not dependent on a single company. Arne ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 08 Jun 2007 11:40:10 -0700 From: ultradwc@gmail.com Subject: Re: Global warming NOT causing more hurricanes UK scientists say Message-ID: <1181328010.291262.157070@e65g2000hsc.googlegroups.com> On Jun 8, 9:42 am, Andrew wrote: > On 7 Jun, 18:06, ultra...@gmail.com wrote: > > > On Jun 7, 11:28 am, Kilgal...@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen) wrote: > > > > In article <1181221267.476748.239...@q66g2000hsg.googlegroups.com>, ultra...@gmail.com writes: > > > > > why will not Andrew listen to his own English scientists? :) > > > > Why will you not stick to on-topic posts ? > > > I just want to help Andrew not look like a fool to his > > own countrymen ... :) > > Bob, repeat after me Sweden is not part of the UK, Puerto Rico is not > part of the UK, the US is not part of the UK. > > I don't know what is more frightening your views on the accuracy of > the old testament or your understanding of Geography. > > Regards > Andrew Harrison isn't Sweden and England both in the EU? ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 08 Jun 2007 19:53:10 GMT From: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Jan-Erik_S=F6derholm?= Subject: Re: Global warming NOT causing more hurricanes UK scientists say Message-ID: ultradwc@gmail.com wrote: > > isn't Sweden and England both in the EU? > Isn't the US and Mexico both in the NAFTA? So what ? What a complete idiot... Jan-Erik (Sweden) ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 9 Jun 2007 01:17:04 +0200 From: "Dr. Dweeb" Subject: Re: Global warming NOT causing more hurricanes UK scientists say Message-ID: <4669e375$0$21928$157c6196@dreader1.cybercity.dk> ultradwc@gmail.com wrote: > On Jun 8, 9:42 am, Andrew wrote: >> On 7 Jun, 18:06, ultra...@gmail.com wrote: >> >>> On Jun 7, 11:28 am, Kilgal...@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen) wrote: >> >>>> In article >>>> <1181221267.476748.239...@q66g2000hsg.googlegroups.com>, >>>> ultra...@gmail.com writes: >> >>>>> why will not Andrew listen to his own English scientists? :) >> >>>> Why will you not stick to on-topic posts ? >> >>> I just want to help Andrew not look like a fool to his >>> own countrymen ... :) >> >> Bob, repeat after me Sweden is not part of the UK, Puerto Rico is not >> part of the UK, the US is not part of the UK. >> >> I don't know what is more frightening your views on the accuracy of >> the old testament or your understanding of Geography. >> >> Regards >> Andrew Harrison > > isn't Sweden and England both in the EU? javist, och hvad så ? ------------------------------ Date: 8 Jun 2007 19:24:10 -0500 From: koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) Subject: Re: Global warming NOT causing more hurricanes UK scientists say Message-ID: <7zoNY4RiFQc$@eisner.encompasserve.org> In article <1181235964.394926.208870@h2g2000hsg.googlegroups.com>, ultradwc@gmail.com writes: > On Jun 7, 11:28 am, Kilgal...@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen) wrote: >> In article <1181221267.476748.239...@q66g2000hsg.googlegroups.com>, ultra...@gmail.com writes: >> >> > why will not Andrew listen to his own English scientists? :) >> >> Why will you not stick to on-topic posts ? > > I just want to help Andrew not look like a fool to his > own countrymen ... :) Yeah, don't try to out-do W. Tony tried and look what it got him. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 08 Jun 2007 14:20:26 -0700 From: Doug Phillips Subject: Re: HOWTO: Ignoring wildly OT threads Message-ID: <1181337626.366449.150050@n4g2000hsb.googlegroups.com> On Jun 8, 12:31 am, John Santos wrote: > Doug Phillips wrote: > > On Jun 7, 8:43 am, Paul Anderson wrote: > > >>In article , > >> Ron Johnson wrote: > > >>>Any dedicated newsreader worth it's salt has an "Ignore thread" > >>>feature. > > >>I heard that doing that contributes to global warming. > > > Only if we don't observe the thread. Weisenheimer's theory of thread > > entanglement says that an off-topic thread in one newsgroup will spawn > > an OT discussion in another group and lead to global warming if the OT > > thread is not observed. Thread noodling by the Flying Spaghetti > > Monster can cause the entanglement to appear random. > > > So says the great Weisenheimer. > > > ;-) > > Is this an example of quantum thread entanglement? AEF, care to > comment? > Weirdness doesn't only happen at the quantum level. Check this out: Go here and click: -> DOWNLOAD THE VIBRATING CORN STARCH MOVIE <- and pick your video format. This experiment might be familiar to some, but I suspect some folk might find it new and interesting. PS: Don't worry, I have no intention of jumping back into the QM wars. Let the future reveal what it may. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 08 Jun 2007 15:00:23 -0700 From: AEF Subject: Re: HOWTO: Ignoring wildly OT threads Message-ID: <1181340023.278508.290660@p47g2000hsd.googlegroups.com> On Jun 8, 5:20 pm, Doug Phillips wrote: > On Jun 8, 12:31 am, John Santos wrote: > > > Doug Phillips wrote: > > > On Jun 7, 8:43 am, Paul Anderson wrote: > > > >>In article , > > >> Ron Johnson wrote: > > > >>>Any dedicated newsreader worth it's salt has an "Ignore thread" > > >>>feature. > > > >>I heard that doing that contributes to global warming. > > > > Only if we don't observe the thread. Weisenheimer's theory of thread > > > entanglement says that an off-topic thread in one newsgroup will spawn > > > an OT discussion in another group and lead to global warming if the OT > > > thread is not observed. Thread noodling by the Flying Spaghetti > > > Monster can cause the entanglement to appear random. > > > > So says the great Weisenheimer. > > > > ;-) > > > Is this an example of quantum thread entanglement? AEF, care to > > comment? > > Weirdness doesn't only happen at the quantum level. > > Check this out: > > Go here > > and click: > > -> DOWNLOAD THE VIBRATING CORN STARCH MOVIE <- > > and pick your video format. > > This experiment might be familiar to some, but I suspect some folk > might find it new and interesting. > > PS: Don't worry, I have no intention of jumping back into the QM wars. > Let the future reveal what it may. Wow! Amazing footage. Thanks! I wonder how Ken Ham and company would explain this! (Though I still think weather systems is a great response for them to chew on.) Anyway, I actually played with cornstarch and water as a kid. I think it was an experiment suggested in the "Weekly Reader". You have to mix cornstarch and water in just the right proportion. It's hard to get it right, but well worth it. You have to add just enough water and you get a fascinating goop. You have to add the water slowly and keep stirring. If you add too much water it doesn't work. Dig a spoon into it and it turns solid. Pick the spoon up, turn the it upside down and it the scooped cornstarch and water mixture turns back to liquid and drains back into the pan. Stirring it is fascinating. If my memory is at all correct, this is highly recommended. Enjoy. AEF AEF ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 08 Jun 2007 15:20:42 -0700 From: AEF Subject: Re: HOWTO: Ignoring wildly OT threads Message-ID: <1181341242.687921.70020@h2g2000hsg.googlegroups.com> On Jun 8, 1:31 am, John Santos wrote: > Doug Phillips wrote: > > On Jun 7, 8:43 am, Paul Anderson wrote: > > >>In article , > >> Ron Johnson wrote: > > >>>Any dedicated newsreader worth it's salt has an "Ignore thread" > >>>feature. > > >>I heard that doing that contributes to global warming. > > > Only if we don't observe the thread. Weisenheimer's theory of thread > > entanglement says that an off-topic thread in one newsgroup will spawn > > an OT discussion in another group and lead to global warming if the OT > > thread is not observed. Thread noodling by the Flying Spaghetti > > Monster can cause the entanglement to appear random. > > > So says the great Weisenheimer. > > > ;-) > > Is this an example of quantum thread entanglement? AEF, care to > comment? > > -- > John Santos > Evans Griffiths & Hart, Inc. > 781-861-0670 ext 539 Well, it could be if the thread were composed of two entangled posts whose wave function is an appropriate superposition of eigenfunctions with the posts then separating into different newsgroups. Then there'd be correlations between what was read on one newsgroup with what was read on the other(s). Reading one would force the wave function to "collapse" into an eigenfunction of the system corresponding to the observable measured in the reading, thereby "affecting" what others would read in the other newsgroup(s). (Wave-function collapse is just one way of determining what would happen. You could also interpret it as simply calculating the probabilities of different outcomes. The results would include the "spooky" correlations. The advantage of looking at it this way is if the observations are spacelike. Being spacelike, it would be possible for two other observers see the two observations happen in different orders. So which one caused the collapse? Considering the entire thing to be one event is a way to get around that. QM tells you that there will be correlations.) Don't know what to make of one thread creating other threads and global warming. I suppose you could have two threads in an appropriate superposition of eigenfunctions, etc. Typing the posts generates heat and then contributes to global warming, but that doesn't require entanglement. This reminds me of one of my favorite physics jokes: Physicists do it by superposition. I also like this: May the net force be with you. AEF ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 08 Jun 2007 17:13:35 -0700 From: Doug Phillips Subject: Re: HOWTO: Ignoring wildly OT threads Message-ID: <1181348015.512832.200750@q69g2000hsb.googlegroups.com> On Jun 8, 5:00 pm, AEF wrote: > On Jun 8, 5:20 pm, Doug Phillips wrote: > > > > > On Jun 8, 12:31 am, John Santos wrote: > > > > Doug Phillips wrote: > > > > On Jun 7, 8:43 am, Paul Anderson wrote: > > > > >>In article , > > > >> Ron Johnson wrote: > > > > >>>Any dedicated newsreader worth it's salt has an "Ignore thread" > > > >>>feature. > > > > >>I heard that doing that contributes to global warming. > > > > > Only if we don't observe the thread. Weisenheimer's theory of thread > > > > entanglement says that an off-topic thread in one newsgroup will spawn > > > > an OT discussion in another group and lead to global warming if the OT > > > > thread is not observed. Thread noodling by the Flying Spaghetti > > > > Monster can cause the entanglement to appear random. > > > > > So says the great Weisenheimer. > > > > > ;-) > > > > Is this an example of quantum thread entanglement? AEF, care to > > > comment? > > > Weirdness doesn't only happen at the quantum level. > > > Check this out: > > > Go here > > > and click: > > > -> DOWNLOAD THE VIBRATING CORN STARCH MOVIE <- > > > and pick your video format. > > > This experiment might be familiar to some, but I suspect some folk > > might find it new and interesting. > > > PS: Don't worry, I have no intention of jumping back into the QM wars. > > Let the future reveal what it may. > > Wow! Amazing footage. Thanks! I wonder how Ken Ham and company would > explain this! (Though I still think weather systems is a great > response for them to chew on.) > > Anyway, I actually played with cornstarch and water as a kid. I think > it was an experiment suggested in the "Weekly Reader". You have to mix > cornstarch and water in just the right proportion. It's hard to get it > right, but well worth it. You have to add just enough water and you > get a fascinating goop. You have to add the water slowly and keep > stirring. If you add too much water it doesn't work. Dig a spoon into > it and it turns solid. Pick the spoon up, turn the it upside down and > it the scooped cornstarch and water mixture turns back to liquid and > drains back into the pan. Stirring it is fascinating. If my memory is > at all correct, this is highly recommended. Enjoy. > The good ol' Weekly reader. Still going strong after 105 years! Here are a couple of K-12 teacher friendly sites that have the goop (oobleck) recipe: This one's at colostate.edu and this one's at science-house.org Fun stuff for kids of all ages:-) ------------------------------ Date: 8 Jun 2007 19:18:00 -0500 From: koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) Subject: Re: HOWTO: Ignoring wildly OT threads Message-ID: In article <1181337626.366449.150050@n4g2000hsb.googlegroups.com>, Doug Phillips writes: > > Weirdness doesn't only happen at the quantum level. > > Check this out: > > Go here > > and click: > > -> DOWNLOAD THE VIBRATING CORN STARCH MOVIE <- > > and pick your video format. The example of cornstarch and water demonstrating non Newtonian-fluid behaviour is well known, but I had never seen these aspects. Wonderfull. ------------------------------ Date: 8 Jun 2007 19:03:02 -0500 From: koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) Subject: Re: HP wasting millions of dollars on itanium! Message-ID: In article , Dave Froble writes: > > Intel went off on a tangent with the itanic, and AMD may have hit Intel > harder than they've ever been hit in their corporate life. Now Intel is > back in the x86 game, "THE GAME", and they got there by by concentrating > on X86. The CIO if Sun just told us there are only three chips. AMD, x86, and SPARC. IBM probably disagrees, but anyway you twist it there is only one instruction set that runs on two of the available chips and it will be with us for a long time. Even Intel can't kill the x86, they tried. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 08 Jun 2007 23:49:29 -0400 From: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Arne_Vajh=F8j?= Subject: Re: HP wasting millions of dollars on itanium! Message-ID: <466a2344$0$90265$14726298@news.sunsite.dk> Bob Koehler wrote: > In article , Dave Froble writes: >> Intel went off on a tangent with the itanic, and AMD may have hit Intel >> harder than they've ever been hit in their corporate life. Now Intel is >> back in the x86 game, "THE GAME", and they got there by by concentrating >> on X86. > > The CIO if Sun just told us there are only three chips. AMD, x86, > and SPARC. IBM probably disagrees, but anyway you twist it there is > only one instruction set that runs on two of the available chips > and it will be with us for a long time. AMD ? x86-64 or ? Arne ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 08 Jun 2007 14:52:57 -0400 From: JF Mezei Subject: Re: Ignoring password history when previous expires/setting expiration time ti Message-ID: <3ecbf$4669a5c0$cef8887a$19325@TEKSAVVY.COM> I do not beleive that user account become "expired" until there is activity on that account (someome trying to login). One totally different approach would be to take hourly backups of sysuaf.dat, and after a clock event has been fixed, restore the latest backup. This way, any users that attempted to login during the clock event would see their acocunt reset to what it was prior to the event. You might also want to backup/restore the hostory file as well as the rightslist file. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 08 Jun 2007 17:47:12 GMT From: Tad Winters Subject: Re: Ignoring password history when previous expires/setting expiration time Message-ID: Marcin 'Rambo' Roguski wrote in news:20070608080959.f2b34245.m_roguski@yahoo.com: > As most of you know, I have a Jensen system now happily running > 7.3-1. And you probably remember that I have dead clock and > set date with NTP. > > Sometimes it happens that NTP doesn't catch on (either by > servers being down, or my Jensen loosing network connection. > Of course that causes machine to believe it's booting a few > thousand days ahead of its last shutdown and all the > passwords expire. > > So: > > a) how to set password expiration to no time? > b) how to "restore" passwords that have already had to be > changed regardless of them being in password history? UAF> modify/flag=(dispwdhis,disforce_pwd_change)/nopwdlifetime/nopwdexpired for each username. IIRC, you're talking about your hobbyist system. (In fact, I can't believe this would be a system for a business, so there's no need to go there. As noted by others, there are other ways to approach this. Those exercises are educational, but a mistake in implementation can cause a repeat of the hassle you're experiencing. Another potential solution regarding the password history is to define the logical which control how many passwords are kept as history, or the logical that control how long passwords are remembered in history. Research on those logical names is left as an exercise. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 08 Jun 2007 15:24:04 -0400 From: JF Mezei Subject: OT: Question to Bob Message-ID: <56128$4669ad0b$cef8887a$21665@TEKSAVVY.COM> Mr Bob, If humans are a creation of god, would you agree that it is an exquisite work of art ? If the human body is a work of art created by god, how come people hide this work of art with clothes ? Shouldn't everyone be walking around totally naked everywhere in order to honour God's work instead of being ashamed of it and trying to hide it ? Isn't it insulting to God that we would be ashamed of his creation ? And, yes, that even includes being naked at the supermarket checkout counter. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 08 Jun 2007 15:54:12 -0400 From: "Richard B. Gilbert" Subject: Re: OT: Question to Bob Message-ID: <4669B3E4.1050205@comcast.net> JF Mezei wrote: > resolve some conundrum asked by kirk> > > > Mr Bob, > > If humans are a creation of god, would you agree that it is an exquisite > work of art ? > > If the human body is a work of art created by god, how come people hide > this work of art with clothes ? > > Shouldn't everyone be walking around totally naked everywhere in order > to honour God's work instead of being ashamed of it and trying to hide > it ? Isn't it insulting to God that we would be ashamed of his creation ? > > And, yes, that even includes being naked at the supermarket checkout > counter. PLEASE!!! Have you looked at the women in the supermarket lately? There are damned few that anyone would want to see naked! They're bad enough with clothes ON!! ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 08 Jun 2007 14:32:17 -0700 From: Doug Phillips Subject: Re: OT: Question to Bob Message-ID: <1181338337.766448.28140@k79g2000hse.googlegroups.com> On Jun 8, 2:54 pm, "Richard B. Gilbert" wrote: > JF Mezei wrote: > > > resolve some conundrum asked by kirk> > > > Mr Bob, > > > If humans are a creation of god, would you agree that it is an exquisite > > work of art ? > > > If the human body is a work of art created by god, how come people hide > > this work of art with clothes ? > > > Shouldn't everyone be walking around totally naked everywhere in order > > to honour God's work instead of being ashamed of it and trying to hide > > it ? Isn't it insulting to God that we would be ashamed of his creation ? > > > And, yes, that even includes being naked at the supermarket checkout > > counter. > > PLEASE!!! Have you looked at the women in the supermarket lately? > There are damned few that anyone would want to see naked! They're bad > enough with clothes ON!! Yuck! Double Yuck! I think I could deal with most naked women, but a vision of all the naked hairy pot-bellied men just flashed through my mind. Triple Yuck! Actually JF, if you read Genesis, it wasn't until Adam & Eve ate the forbidden fruit that they became ashamed and felt the need to cover themselves. That's the story, anyway, and that's what bob will probably say. Some other religions have similar stories, and some people do run around fairly naked. The need to protect ones sensitive areas from harm, though, is just a common sense thing. ------------------------------ Date: 8 Jun 2007 19:36:57 -0500 From: koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) Subject: Re: OT: Question to Bob Message-ID: <7p6Al0fEdCJY@eisner.encompasserve.org> In article <1181338337.766448.28140@k79g2000hse.googlegroups.com>, Doug Phillips writes: > > Actually JF, if you read Genesis, it wasn't until Adam & Eve ate the > forbidden fruit that they became ashamed and felt the need to cover > themselves. Hm,... If I follow this you're talking anbout two wrongs, then? ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 08 Jun 2007 18:13:13 -0700 From: Doug Phillips Subject: Re: OT: Question to Bob Message-ID: <1181351593.579749.295120@q69g2000hsb.googlegroups.com> On Jun 8, 7:36 pm, koeh...@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) wrote: > In article <1181338337.766448.28...@k79g2000hse.googlegroups.com>, Doug Phillips writes: > > > > > Actually JF, if you read Genesis, it wasn't until Adam & Eve ate the > > forbidden fruit that they became ashamed and felt the need to cover > > themselves. > > Hm,... If I follow this you're talking anbout two wrongs, then? Well, you'll just have to read the story, I guess. Doesn't matter whether one believes it or not or what one does or doesn't believe; if a person hasn't read and tried to understand a religion or philosophy then they have no sound basis for belief or disbelief. The Adam & Eve, forbidden fruit & temptation story tells of the "original sin" which is at the heart of many/most Biblical religions. I have no comment about whether it's fact or fable. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 08 Jun 2007 14:26:49 -0400 From: "Richard B. Gilbert" Subject: Out of office messages! Message-ID: <46699F69.6020200@comcast.net> I seem to be getting a real plague of 'Out of Office" messages. I don't care!! I doubt very much if anybody else cares either! Please unsubscribe or have your "OoO" ignore traffic from mailing lists, if possible. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 8 Jun 2007 15:21:40 -0400 From: "John Smith" Subject: Re: porting ignorance (was Re: Story Time) Message-ID: <44214$4669ac3b$cef88391$26774@TEKSAVVY.COM-Free> davidc@montagar.com wrote: > On Jun 7, 2:59 pm, "John Smith" wrote: >> What HP ought to do is take some of their $8 billion profits and >> fund some greybeards to port the still-as-yet un-ported necessary >> bits. Grease the wheel a bit. > > Well, something along those lines is worth asking about. Maybe some > kind of contest? Not a contest as there's progress to be made in a number of areas. What's required is a list of all the bits that need to get ported, then the list needs to be prioritized and estimates of the amount of work that needs to be done for each. The gathering of the list can be done via a poll/survey, with contributors being required to provide some verbiage as to their rationale for choosing a particular routine or feature. This will give those that allocate the funds - and I'd suggest that it be a mix of OpenVMS engineers currently on-staff @ HP, some people like Hoff, Guy Peleg, etc..., and others like VAXman (not to single him out) and other ISV's, plus some really knowledgeable people at large customer sites. An odd-numbered group so that there is always a tie-breaking vote. Then based on the estimated effort for the most needed ports, the $1 million or whatever the number is gets allocated pro-rata to each project. People sign-up to the project that suits their talent. Peer review of those who are interested in doing the work (or some other mechanism to ensure that wankers aren't trying to scam money) and then a selection is made as to who actually does the work if the 'team' is over-subscribed. Teams rate each other member of the team to fine-tune the division of the spoils, ie. if a team of three is working on one port and one person is doing the heavy lifting, then that person should get more of the booty. With rabid and quality greybeards, the money is not necessarily ythe end goal, but it helps focus the mind and postpone the fishing trip until the code is regression tested and there's no obvious bugs. Other approaches could be employed. (sorry about the typos - using a crappy HP laptop keyuboard with no finger-feel) -- OpenVMS - The never-advertised operating system with the dwindling ISV base. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 08 Jun 2007 13:59:57 -0700 From: "Tom Linden" Subject: Re: porting ignorance (was Re: Story Time) Message-ID: On Fri, 08 Jun 2007 12:21:40 -0700, John Smith wrote: > davidc@montagar.com wrote: >> On Jun 7, 2:59 pm, "John Smith" wrote: >>> What HP ought to do is take some of their $8 billion profits and >>> fund some greybeards to port the still-as-yet un-ported necessary >>> bits. Grease the wheel a bit. >> >> Well, something along those lines is worth asking about. Maybe some >> kind of contest? > > > Not a contest as there's progress to be made in a number of areas. > > What's required is a list of all the bits that need to get ported, then > the > list needs to be prioritized and estimates of the amount of work that > needs > to be done for each. > > The gathering of the list can be done via a poll/survey, with > contributors > being required to provide some verbiage as to their rationale for > choosing a > particular routine or feature. This will give those that allocate the > funds - and I'd suggest that it be a mix of OpenVMS engineers currently > on-staff @ HP, some people like Hoff, Guy Peleg, etc..., and others like > VAXman (not to single him out) and other ISV's, plus some really > knowledgeable people at large customer sites. An odd-numbered group so > that > there is always a tie-breaking vote. > > Then based on the estimated effort for the most needed ports, the $1 > million > or whatever the number is gets allocated pro-rata to each project. > > People sign-up to the project that suits their talent. Peer review of > those > who are interested in doing the work (or some other mechanism to ensure > that > wankers aren't trying to scam money) and then a selection is made as to > who > actually does the work if the 'team' is over-subscribed. > > Teams rate each other member of the team to fine-tune the division of the > spoils, ie. if a team of three is working on one port and one person is > doing the heavy lifting, then that person should get more of the booty. > > With rabid and quality greybeards, the money is not necessarily ythe end > goal, but it helps focus the mind and postpone the fishing trip until the > code is regression tested and there's no obvious bugs. > > Other approaches could be employed. > > (sorry about the typos - using a crappy HP laptop keyuboard with no > finger-feel) > > > -- > OpenVMS - The never-advertised operating system with the dwindling ISV > base. > > What is remarkable about this discussion is that it is even taking place. What is wrong with the VMS organization that they can't figure this out and do it themselves, they certainly have healthy margins. Outside of Linux, I can't think of such an effort ever having taken place, although I suppose you could argue that SHARE had some of these attributes. -- PL/I for OpenVMS www.kednos.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 08 Jun 2007 14:49:53 -0700 From: davidc@montagar.com Subject: Re: porting ignorance (was Re: Story Time) Message-ID: <1181339393.719953.45110@h2g2000hsg.googlegroups.com> On Jun 8, 2:21 pm, "John Smith" wrote: > Not a contest as there's progress to be made in a number of areas. > > What's required is a list of all the bits that need to get ported, then the > list needs to be prioritized and estimates of the amount of work that needs > to be done for each. Some contest could still be done, although I think it would have to be a series of contests at the very least. Since many applications are layered on the same sets of libraries, it shouldn't be difficult to identify those key libraries (for instance, the most obvious is libc), and start from there. For instance, Xpdf is based upon on about 16 other libraries. Those libraries could be included for a first round of development, with Xpdf as the goal application. Also, I think the concentration on "grey-beards" is a little misguided. Yes, they should be involved, but we need to encourage new blood into the VMS camp. By opening up the porting work to colleges and universities (which can use the Educational License Program for free, too) we can likely get a lot of work from students trying to prove their skills, thus introducing them to VMS as well as grooming the next generation of developers. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 09 Jun 2007 00:05:55 +0200 From: "P. Sture" Subject: Re: porting ignorance (was Re: Story Time) Message-ID: In article <1181339393.719953.45110@h2g2000hsg.googlegroups.com>, davidc@montagar.com wrote: > On Jun 8, 2:21 pm, "John Smith" wrote: > > Not a contest as there's progress to be made in a number of areas. > > > > What's required is a list of all the bits that need to get ported, then the > > list needs to be prioritized and estimates of the amount of work that needs > > to be done for each. > > Some contest could still be done, although I think it would have to be > a series of contests at the very least. Since many applications are > layered on the same sets of libraries, it shouldn't be difficult to > identify those key libraries (for instance, the most obvious is libc), > and start from there. For instance, Xpdf is based upon on about 16 > other libraries. Those libraries could be included for a first round > of development, with Xpdf as the goal application. A port of Xpdf for Alpha already exists: http://www.openvms.org/stories.php?story=07/05/21/0159781 > Also, I think the concentration on "grey-beards" is a little > misguided. Yes, they should be involved, but we need to encourage new > blood into the VMS camp. By opening up the porting work to colleges > and universities (which can use the Educational License Program for > free, too) we can likely get a lot of work from students trying to > prove their skills, thus introducing them to VMS as well as grooming > the next generation of developers. -- Paul Sture ------------------------------ Date: 8 Jun 2007 19:27:30 -0500 From: koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) Subject: Re: Restoring an IMAGE backup to a BIND volume set ? Message-ID: In article <136grc3q1ml3n80@corp.supernews.com>, "Syltrem" writes: > Hello ! > > I need to restore an image backup (40GB) onto a bind set (2 x 36GB) > > Since I must mount /FOREIGN for the restore, there is not bind set... > You can do a non-image restore from an image save set, but you might have alias issues. ------------------------------ Date: 8 Jun 2007 19:29:44 -0500 From: koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) Subject: Re: Restoring an IMAGE backup to a BIND volume set ? Message-ID: In article , JF Mezei writes: > Syltrem wrote: >> I need to restore an image backup (40GB) onto a bind set (2 x 36GB) >> >> Since I must mount /FOREIGN for the restore, there is not bind set... > > I do not believe you can do this. > > Backup restores files maintaining the same file IDs. Only if you do an image restore. \ ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 8 Jun 2007 19:49:14 +0000 (UTC) From: helbig@astro.multiCLOTHESvax.de (Phillip Helbig---remove CLOTHES to reply) Subject: Re: SECURITY.AUDIT$JOURNAL and ERRLOG.SYS Message-ID: In article , "P. Sture" writes: > I'll just add a reminder here that SYLOGICALS.TEMPLATE contains a list > of candidates for moving off the system disk to a separate cluster > common disk. Yes, but only for those files which can be moved somewhere else by defining a logical. In other cases, the file name is the argument of (the option of) a command, or will be placed in the first translation of a search-list of directories, or whatever. Thus, SYLOGICALS.TEMPLATE is good as far as it goes, but it doesn't go far enough. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 08 Jun 2007 22:38:25 -0000 From: ultradwc@gmail.com Subject: Re: Story Time Message-ID: <1181342305.923861.320880@g4g2000hsf.googlegroups.com> On Jun 5, 10:11 am, b...@cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon) wrote: > > Nice excuse, but I just told you they have a VMS machine here for academic > use. It is running all the time. No one uses it. Now, why would that be? I think we know the answer to that one just by reading your comments ... > Read my lips, there is academic use of BSDUnix, Linux, > Solaris, Windows, QNX, BrickOS, etc. etc. There is no academic use > of VMS. ever hear of WVUnet? ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 8 Jun 2007 18:43:12 -0400 From: "Main, Kerry" Subject: RE: Story Time Message-ID: > -----Original Message----- > From: bill@triangle.cs.uofs.edu [mailto:bill@triangle.cs.uofs.edu] On > Behalf Of Bill Gunshannon > Sent: June 8, 2007 12:54 PM > To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com > Subject: Re: Story Time >=20 > In article > t>, > "Main, Kerry" writes: > > [snip ...] > > > > Did I note in one of your other replies that you stated your > University > > was running Banner on OpenVMS? >=20 > Yes. For the moment. I thought I had heard rumblings somewhere about > Banner moving to Windows, but I can't say for sure. I hear lot's of > rumors around here that aren't even close to reality. In any event, > none of the users would have any idea that VMS is involved as all > access > is through Windows interfaces. >=20 > > > > Thx >=20 > Your welcome, but I don't know what value this info actually is to > you. :-) >=20 > bill >=20 Well, my experience with Banner on Universities is that this is *the" mission critical application of the University. It is similar to SAP in companies as it contains HR, payroll, registration, scheduling and many other aspects of running the University. My point is that unless your University is different than other Universities I have been involved with, while OpenVMS may not play a big part on the Academic side of the University, if Banner is running on it, then it is typically the *heart* of the University Administration. It sounds like OpenVMS is indeed playing a huge role in your University. In addition, while the Academic side of the University tends to jump from technology to technology (depending on the College), the Administration is much more conservative and risk adverse. Note - from what I have heard (no direct experience), switching Banner platforms is not an easy task due to all of the customization that typically occurs over the years - regardless of the platform. Re: Windows GUI for Banner .. exactly what many OpenVMS application environments have done i.e. rock solid, ultra high security on the back end with user friendly front ends. And while other platform environments try to keep up with the numerous monthly security patches, this platform just keeps on running. Btw, it likely is also running Oracle as well.=20 Certainly nothing wrong with this GUI picture. In fact, if the Admin side has been keeping up, they may even be monitoring and managing the OpenVMS back end with Java or Windows based GUI's from client side desktops e.g. Availability Manager or OpenVMS Console Manager or other client side GUI's available for managing OpenVMS. Regards Kerry Main Senior Consultant HP Services Canada Voice: 613-592-4660 Fax: 613-591-4477 kerryDOTmainAThpDOTcom (remove the DOT's and AT)=20 OpenVMS - the secure, multi-site OS that just works. =20 ------------------------------ Date: 8 Jun 2007 18:47:55 -0500 From: koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) Subject: Re: Story Time Message-ID: In article , Brian2007 writes: > > For years, I’ve been hearing from folks telling me that OpenVMS is > dying, and it’s been good and fun with VMS, but, it time go on something > else, blah blah blah and so forth. Let’s not forget that VMS have never > been hit by hackers, virus and Trojan for over 30 years and still > ticking. Well, I'm sitting hewre wondering what character is (probably a Microsoft "smart quote" for ' ). Meanwhile the above simply isn't true. There have been holes in older versions of VMS and their were episodes where they were exploited. Unlike other OS, something serious was done in addition to issuing a security patch. ------------------------------ Date: 8 Jun 2007 18:52:09 -0500 From: koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) Subject: Re: Story Time Message-ID: In article <18bce$466707ba$cef8887a$11966@TEKSAVVY.COM>, JF Mezei writes: > Bob Koehler wrote: >> There are so many things that are desired on VMS that would most >> likely be used on faster processors that I can see that a new VAX >> release would not be in the top 100. > > > How come then HP committed to do an 8.x release of VAX ? Because they assumed it would be at least number 99? > The issue here is of trust. But not doing an 8.x version of VAX, HP is > renegging on a promise, and this underlines the fact that the roadmap is > just a work of fiction that customers cannot count on when they make > their own IT roadmaps. I learned from HP's behaviour long before Compaq bought DEC not to trust them. Nothing they've done since has changed my opinion. There are some people within HP that I find trustworthy, but they're pretty far from the top. ------------------------------ Date: 9 Jun 2007 00:33:51 GMT From: bill@cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon) Subject: Re: Story Time Message-ID: <5cuarfF320emgU1@mid.individual.net> In article <1181342305.923861.320880@g4g2000hsf.googlegroups.com>, ultradwc@gmail.com writes: > On Jun 5, 10:11 am, b...@cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon) wrote: >> >> Nice excuse, but I just told you they have a VMS machine here for academic >> use. It is running all the time. No one uses it. Now, why would that be? > > I think we know the answer to that one just by reading your > comments ... > >> Read my lips, there is academic use of BSDUnix, Linux, >> Solaris, Windows, QNX, BrickOS, etc. etc. There is no academic use >> of VMS. > > ever hear of WVUnet? Yeah, but we were talking about my University and I'm not in West Virginia. bill -- Bill Gunshannon | de-moc-ra-cy (di mok' ra see) n. Three wolves bill@cs.scranton.edu | and a sheep voting on what's for dinner. University of Scranton | Scranton, Pennsylvania | #include ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 08 Jun 2007 23:28:15 -0400 From: =?windows-1252?Q?Arne_Vajh=F8j?= Subject: Re: Story Time Message-ID: <466a1e4c$0$90262$14726298@news.sunsite.dk> Bob Koehler wrote: > In article , Brian2007 writes: >> For years, I’ve been hearing from folks telling me that OpenVMS is >> dying, and it’s been good and fun with VMS, but, it time go on something >> else, blah blah blah and so forth. Let’s not forget that VMS have never >> been hit by hackers, virus and Trojan for over 30 years and still >> ticking. > > Well, I'm sitting hewre wondering what character is (probably > a Microsoft "smart quote" for ' ). > > Meanwhile the above simply isn't true. There have been holes in > older versions of VMS and their were episodes where they were > exploited. > > Unlike other OS, something serious was done in addition to issuing > a security patch. You are probably thinking about WANK (Worms Against Nuclear Killers) and the rather relaxed attitude to DECnet accounts before 5.something. Arne ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 8 Jun 2007 15:22:30 -0400 From: "David Turner, Island Computers" Subject: U160 Raid Ctr Special for June 07 Message-ID: <136jb3db9fbqie5@news.supernews.com> We have a quantity of "as new" 3X-KZPDC-BE Raid controllers These are the VMS compatible 7.3-1> U160 Dual Channel Controllers with 128MB (upgradable to 256) Internal Dual Channel and External Dual Channel Works with DS10 DS15 DS20 and DS20e DS25 ES40 ES45 GS160 etc. Only $549 while stocks last David -- David B Turner Island Computers US Corp 2700 Gregory St, Suite 180 Savannah GA 31404 T: 877-6364332 x201 Intl: 001 912 447 6622 E: dturner@islandco.com F: 912 201 0402 W: http://www.islandco.com -- David B Turner Island Computers US Corp 2700 Gregory St, Suite 180 Savannah GA 31404 T: 877-6364332 x201 Intl: 001 912 447 6622 E: dturner@islandco.com F: 912 201 0402 W: http://www.islandco.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 8 Jun 2007 19:50:22 +0000 (UTC) From: helbig@astro.multiCLOTHESvax.de (Phillip Helbig---remove CLOTHES to reply) Subject: Re: using RBLs interactively Message-ID: In article , "P. Sture" writes: > And here's the answer to the behaviour that John saw, leading to his > speculation that all IPv4 addresses are listed: > > From > > ----------------------------------------------------------------------- > You are probably looking for spamhaus.org! > > If you are not automatically redirected click here. > > SPAMHOUSE.ORG is not a DNSbl! > > Queries to SPAMHOUSE.ORG will ALWAYS return a positive lookup. Yes, but why all the trouble? ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 08 Jun 2007 23:49:43 +0200 From: "P. Sture" Subject: Re: using RBLs interactively Message-ID: In article , helbig@astro.multiCLOTHESvax.de (Phillip Helbig---remove CLOTHES to reply) wrote: > In article , "P. > Sture" writes: > > > And here's the answer to the behaviour that John saw, leading to his > > speculation that all IPv4 addresses are listed: > > > > From > > > > ----------------------------------------------------------------------- > > You are probably looking for spamhaus.org! > > > > If you are not automatically redirected click here. > > > > SPAMHOUSE.ORG is not a DNSbl! > > > > Queries to SPAMHOUSE.ORG will ALWAYS return a positive lookup. > > Yes, but why all the trouble? I suspect a historical reason, such as someone frustrated by seeing the HOUSE variant used when it shouldn't be. -- Paul Sture ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 08 Jun 2007 21:05:33 -0400 From: JF Mezei Subject: Re: using RBLs interactively Message-ID: <3f86a$4669fd14$cef8887a$12470@TEKSAVVY.COM> >> > SPAMHOUSE.ORG is not a DNSbl! >> > >> > Queries to SPAMHOUSE.ORG will ALWAYS return a positive lookup. >> >> Yes, but why all the trouble? Probably someone who had registered that domain in the great hopes that the great big and cash rich spamhaus.org would be willing to dish out mega money to get spamhouse.org. When it didn't happen, he rebelled by setting up his own RBL that effectively blocks all mail. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 08 Jun 2007 19:20:02 GMT From: "Jerry Alan Braga" Subject: world priv on sysuaf account Message-ID: What does the world priv on an account expose ? ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 08 Jun 2007 19:33:39 GMT From: Rob Brown Subject: Re: world priv on sysuaf account Message-ID: On Fri, 8 Jun 2007, Jerry Alan Braga wrote: > What does the world priv on an account expose ? WORLD privilege allows you to control any process on the system. Similarly, GROUP privilege allows you to control process in the same UIC group as your UIC. -- Rob Brown b r o w n a t g m c l d o t c o m G. Michaels Consulting Ltd. (780)438-9343 (voice) Edmonton (780)437-3367 (FAX) http://gmcl.com/ ------------------------------ Date: 8 Jun 2007 19:35:20 -0500 From: koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) Subject: Re: world priv on sysuaf account Message-ID: <4e6HRjXbAoe+@eisner.encompasserve.org> In article , "Jerry Alan Braga" writes: > What does the world priv on an account expose ? The world. Processes having world privilege can interfere with all other processes, like killing processes that don't belong to the same user. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 09 Jun 2007 01:19:52 GMT From: Tad Winters Subject: Re: world priv on sysuaf account Message-ID: koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) wrote in news:4e6HRjXbAoe+@eisner.encompasserve.org: > In article , "Jerry Alan Braga" > writes: > >> What does the world priv on an account expose ? > > The world. Processes having world privilege can interfere with all > other processes, like killing processes that don't belong to the > same user. > > That reminds me of a time long ago (18 years) where a certain 2 junior admins (the offenders) took it upon themselves to remove the typical privileges of the other junior admins (including me.) They did leave WORLD. Big mistake. Another of the offended admins submitted a batch job which looped through the processes and terminated those whose usernames were those of the offenders. After a completion of the loop, the batch job verified there was also a batch job with the same name running on the other cluster node, then it waited for 10 (maybe 30) seconds and started again. The offenders found themselves very frustrated for a couple hours before they finally agreed (in the presence of our supervisor) to restore our privileges. Oops, I guess that didn't answer any questions...or did it? ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 08 Jun 2007 17:23:34 -0700 From: stuie_norris@yahoo.com.au Subject: [Q]Pascal packed arrary of char and varying of char Message-ID: <1181348614.361921.146850@z28g2000prd.googlegroups.com> Hi Group, I am trying to update a pascal program, with very little pascal experience. The code is full of string of two types - packed array of char and varying of char. Most places it uses packed array of char and then copies this to varying of char. In the routines that have the varying of char I am trying to work out the length of the string to display nicely. In the following code I am trying to obtain the the length the varying of char string, that has been 'copied' from packed array of char. However I always get 50. How do I work out the length of the varying of char string? (I thinks 22 is the correct answer) Thanks Stuart [inherit ('sys$library:starlet', 'sys$library:pascal$lib_routines')] program test (input, output); type mystring = varying [256] of char; var namepacked : packed array [1..50] of char; namevary : mystring; begin namepacked := 'the cat sat on the mat'; namevary := namepacked; writeln ('Length = ', length(namevary), ' .Length =',namevary.length); end. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 08 Jun 2007 23:16:18 -0400 From: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Arne_Vajh=F8j?= Subject: Re: [Q]Pascal packed arrary of char and varying of char Message-ID: <466a1b7d$0$90273$14726298@news.sunsite.dk> stuie_norris@yahoo.com.au wrote: > I am trying to update a pascal program, with very little pascal > experience. > > The code is full of string of two types - packed array of char and > varying of char. > > Most places it uses packed array of char and then copies this to > varying of char. > In the routines that have the varying of char I am trying to work out > the length of the string to display nicely. > > In the following code I am trying to obtain the the length the varying > of char string, that has been 'copied' from packed array of char. > However I always get 50. > > How do I work out the length of the varying of char string? (I thinks > 22 is the correct answer) > [inherit ('sys$library:starlet', 'sys$library:pascal$lib_routines')] > program test (input, output); > > type > mystring = varying [256] of char; > > var > namepacked : packed array [1..50] of char; > namevary : mystring; > > begin > > namepacked := 'the cat sat on the mat'; > namevary := namepacked; > > writeln ('Length = ', length(namevary), ' .Length > =',namevary.length); > end. It is correct. You take a fixed length string with 50 chars and assign ti a variable length string and get 50 chars. You will need to trim them. program test (input, output); type mystring = varying [256] of char; var namepacked : packed array [1..50] of char; namevary : mystring; ix : integer; begin namepacked := 'the cat sat on the mat'; namevary := namepacked; ix := namevary.length; while (ix > 1) and (namevary[ix] = ' ') do ix := ix - 1; namevary := substr(namevary, 1, ix); writeln ('Length = ', length(namevary), ' .Length=',namevary.length); end. seems to work ! Arne ------------------------------ End of INFO-VAX 2007.313 ************************